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'BobbyP' wrote on '02:
Something that I did not cover in introducing myself was the nitty-gritty reason that I THINK my insomnia got started about a year ago. Granted, part of this is probably just that I'm “getting older” and therefore not sleeping as soundly as I used to (yes, I'm over 55!). But I have a loving, wonderful fiance partner, who unfortunately I can only visit with on the week-ends. My partner does NOT have “restless leg syndrome” but rather something called “periodic limb movement disorder” (PLMD) or more technically “nocturnal myoclonus.” This has gone on for years, but apparently I was always able to sleep through it, until about a year ago when I gradually got more and more aware of it during the night, and it started waking me up, and then I couldn't just ignore it and go back to sleep.
What happens is that he will do this little kicking movement with his legs for a few seconds, then about 20 to 30 seconds later, he does it again. Over and over. Minor, yes. But even in a king-size bed, I can sense it, I wake up, and then it keeps me awake because I can't make him stop (poor guy!). It's not like snoring, where you just get the person to change positions, or put earplugs in your own ears. We've researched it online and spoken to his doctor, but it really is pretty harmless and can only be treated with majorly serious medications, which I refuse to force him to do.
So we have taken turns sleeping in separate bedrooms — and I hate it, of course, and it doesn't really help me. I just lie there feeling guilty that we've had to made this change. But this was the beginning of my insomnia. Even during the week, when he's not there, I wake up after only two or three hours of sleep and start worrying that I won't be able to go back to sleep. So despite the “leg-twitching” being the start of this, apparently my mind has gotten overly-anxious about the insomnia, so it just keeps going all week long.
I also have trouble when there is anything the least bit out-of-the-ordinary coming up, like a trip or a social event. Basically, I just cannot sleep AT ALL prior to these things. So we've given up a lot of the trips we used to take. And I'm pretty much a zombie at any wedding receptions, parties, family events, etc. that we have to attend, because I'm always operating on zero hours of sleep.
I've gotten very long-winded here, but I'm hoping perhaps someone has experienced something similar and might have some suggestions. Just “venting” has certainly helped me. Thanks, Insomnia Land!!
This is not in reply to your “restless leg” problems, but to my own situation. I unfortunately have to take lots of sleep meds (or I would never get ANY SLEEP at all). My recent plan is to take Temazepam 30mg, Seroquil 25mg and ativan 2mg for the nights I have to go to work the next day and then take 2 Temazepam on the non-work nights. This has been working for some time but last night I had a terrible sleep even with the 60mg Temazepam. I woke up at 4am with the terrible headache (I don't get headaches). So this destroyed the one night I thought I could count on. Very discouraging. My MD prescribed another sleep med which I stopped because it didn't seem to work and made me have bad dreams. But if my 2 Temazepam doesn't work anymore I'm going to try this tonight. With this terrible problem affecting millions of us, why hasn't anyone come up with a real solution?
'yoink15' wrote on '25:Hello all,
So I've been struggling with insomnia for about three months now. I introduced myself in the other forum earlier this month.
In addition to insomnia, I suffer from something called Chronic Pelvic Pain Syndrome (also called non-bacterial chronic prostatitis)…it's basically constant pain in and around the prostate area of the pelvis…and the need to urinate often.
I've lived with it for four years without having any sleep or anxiety issues…but about three months ago my symptoms wildly flared up and I had to take medical leave from work it got so bad.
I developed anxiety and insomnia over the whole thing.
Now as my symptoms are starting to get a little bit better (I am following a very strict physical therapy and relaxation routine)…I'm still struggling with anxiety and insomnia.
I'm taking Buspar 5mg tablets, three times a day…it's helping with the anxiety.
However, the question I wanted to ask all of you…a big part of my insomnia is a very, very strange sensation that I get in the morning that prevents me from falling back to sleep. I usually go to bed at around 11pm or midnight and I usually don't have any trouble falling asleep…but I almost always wake up about 3 hours later (because I have to urinate). Then when I try to fall back to sleep…this is when the sensation hits me.
It's hard to describe but I'll do my best. I can feel myself relaxing…and starting to drift off into sleep…and then I get this strange tingly almost electrical feeling in my hands and face…it's not pleasant feeling, and I can almost feel myself being “pulled” back out of sleep and into wakefullness. My heart rate jumps a little and I feel a little upset in my stomach. And then…boom…I'm awake. And I can't fall back asleep at all. And if I try again…I start to relax, drift off into sleep…and the whole cycle repeats! Electrical/tingly feeling in the hands, “pulling” feeling in the brain and I'm back awake. What the hell is that all about? Why is my mind/body pulling back out of sleep before I even fall into sleep?
Has anyone else ever heard of this or felt anything like this?
P.S. I don't think it's the Buspar that's doing it…because this thing was happening to me a full month before I started taking the Buspar for anxiety.
-Yoink
Anxiety plays a huge role in my insomnia. I knew that my boss was not going to be into work a couple of days ago and I had a better sleep than usual. She isn't going to be in tomorrow at all – so I expect that that my sleep will be OK tonight.
'Nikki' wrote on '18:Hi everyone, my name is Nikki and I am a 32 year old woman living in Henderson Nevada, right outside Las Vegas. I moved here with my family about 4 years ago. I have a husband and a 13 year old son. I currently work as a cocktail waitress at nights and am starting school to get my nursing degree.
I have had insomnia since I was about 8 years old. I had this dream that it would get better as I got older but instead it seems to be getting worse. On most days I get 3 or 4 hours but I can have days where I go without any. I have tried almost every sleeping med, OTC and prescription, and most traditonal and non traditonal methods to help me sleep. Nothing works. I won't get go into tons of details but suffice to say, I am physically, mentally, and emotionally exhausted.
I am hoping that this forum will give me some conatct with people who truly understand. My family is supportive but I don't believe anyone who hasn't gone through insomnia can actually understand. I am hoping to be able to find and give support to people like me.
Thanks for listening and its nice to meet you all 🙂
Nikki,
Welcome. Right now I'm 68 and have had chronic Insomnia for about 30 years. I'm forced to take meds as I could not sleep (naturally) without them.
'Martin' wrote on '21:That's really interesting. I know one or two members have had some sleep studies done – I wonder if they were also 'dual diagnosed' (so to speak). Let me dig around and see if I can find the members in question of they don't come forward first!
I'll also post this question in the next Insomniac Bulletin as I'm really interested to hear from our other members on this issue.
Martin,
My son got 2 shifts this week and so just maybe we will be able to stay in our home afterall. I have a huge fear of having to leave our family home (that is the BIG fear with the money)
'sleeplessinky' wrote on '22:Hi Nicole…..I'm interested in learning the results of your sleep study when you have it. Our symptoms are so similiar. Waking up throughout the night is the story of my life. Yes, I do think that depression is part of my problem but for some reason I'm reluctant to take anti-depressants. When I looked up on the internet the med that was prescribed for me, it listed insomnia as one of the side effects I definitely won't take that one but I am trying to decide whether to ask for something else. I hope that the Cymbalta starts working for you. Good luck on the sleep study as well.
I take Seroquel and I asked my MD if that caused insomnia and she said that certain anti-depressants do cause insomnia but Seroquel wasn't one of them.
'sleeplessinky' wrote on '21:After suffering with insomnia for a long time, I finally went to a sleep specialist, had a sleep study and was diagnosed with sleep apnea. The sleep specialist was of the opinion that the apnea was causing the insomnia. I've been on CPAP therapy for about 3 weeks, changed masks once since the first one drove me crazy and found the second one to be fairly comfortable (such as CPAP masks go). I'm falling asleep fairly easily with the mask on but waking up an hour or two later and either taking hours to get back to sleep or not getting back to sleep at all. This is what was happening before the sleep study. It's obvious to me now that I have two separate sleep disorders and treatment for apnea is not helping the insomnia. In fact, the sad part of this is that while waiting for the sleep study, I was just starting to sleep better as I followed various behavioral tecniques that were working. So, here I am now at Square One.
That sucks big time. That pattern – falling asleep an then waking up in a couple of hours and then not going back to sleep at all or taking ages to go back to sleep is a connom pattern of mine.
'ginger2003' wrote on '21:When you can't sleep? I've tried reading, tv and listening to the radio but those night time hours seem to drag so much and I'm too tired to do anything productive.
How does your insomnia effect you during the day, do you just try and carry on as normal or is that impossible? I try to carry on as normal as possible but it's not always easy! Holding down a job and having a family to look after is hard when you are sleep deprived.
Nikki
I take pills to sleep. So I don't have to think about what to do. But now my sleep is “wake and worry”. So when I wake up (maybe 8 times/night) I say to myself, “NO BRAIN, NO WORRY” No brain means to not use my brain at all. Because thinking always leads to worry.
The other night when I came home from work, I actually fell asleep naturally. WOW! How long since that's happened.
'Daz27041' wrote on '15:Hi PatO,
Thanks for the welcome to the group. I am going to have to start getting out of bed as being in bed awake is associating the brain with 'It's ok to lie here and not be asleep'. I too will have to start a journal recording my sleeping habits and hygiene. One integral part of the program I will be resuming is to stay up atleast 1 hour past your normal bedtime. The author warns that you may get less sleep in the short term, but in the long term it will be resetting the biological clock and as sleep comes easier you can start winding back the lateness of going to bed and slowly get to bed earlier over time. My issue is sleep on-set. Getting to sleep. Once I am asleep no problems, I don't wake up and if I do I can go right back to sleep usually without a problem. I have a friend, a fellow police officer who has to be in bed every night by 9.30pm as she will be awake anytime from 1-2am and will stay awake the rest of the night. She has been like this her entire life. She limits personal activities in the evening as she has to be in bed ready to go to sleep at her appointed time. Sometime she lays there for a while before going to sleep. She too is trying the program and had some early success, once even sleeping till about 4.30am. She came in to work absolutely glowing and on cloud nine. She had not slept that good in a very very long time. I forgot to mention it but I am also taking powder magnesium as well as it can have great effects on insomnia. I might double the dose to one tsp in the morning and another at night. I am really amazed at something which I have managed to do automatically for 41 years, now somehow for some reason eludes me. I would like to see/hear from someone who can dispel the myths associated with insomnia. I think this in turn would ease my sleep anxiety a little. I wish you the best of luck PatO.
There's a lot of talk about “Sleep Hygene” What exactly is sleep hygene? I'm going to my GP tomorrow again to see if she can come up with some “miracle”. All I can do now is take my usual 3 sleep meds and tonight I'm taking an extra Temazepam at 2 or 3 am. Last time I tried this it took ages to kick in (more anxiety about – now is this not going to work too?) but the next thing I knew it was 8:30am (not a work day).
'sleepy' wrote on '23:Hi, my name is Danielle and I'm from Ohio. I found your great group by accident…trying to google yet again “insomnia” information and your site came up. My physician tells me I need to relax more and my insomnia will go away. I own a small business, married to a cop and my youngest just left for college…how am I supposed to relax?
I look forward to talking with you!
Just relax and your insomnia will go away??? That's the problem – HOW ON EARTH DO anxious, tense and in my case scared people relax? I took a long bus ride today (as one of my MANY attempts to relax) but the big problem is that I can't leave my brain at home. I took all of my anxieties (including loosing some of my hours at my job) with me and frankly the bus ride did little to help at all.I still can't understand why medical science hasn't found better answers. When I hear someone say “I'll feel better after a good nights sleep” I almost start to cry! How long has it been since I got a good nights sleep? When I was a kid. Looking at a sleeping child fills me with such longing to be able to simply SLEEP.
'Nicole' wrote on '05:Hello. My insomnia started as soon as I delivered my daughter 6 years ago and I suffered from Post partum depression. Prior to that I had a wonderful relationship with sleep. I NEVER suffered insomnia before giving birth and I would often take wonderful naps with no problem. My napping days are over, Ever since giving birth I just can't fall asleep to take a nap even when I'm tired. I suffer from depression and it seems whenever I change my meds the insomnia strikes. It is so intense I went one night with only two hours sleep while taking a sleeping pill. My first battle with insomnia was fixed with lorazepan and paxil. My next bout was more severe and I tried ambien, ambien CR, lorazepan (no longer worked like the first time) and finally got it under control with 150mg trazadone. Recently I went off effexor which I was taking with 150 mg trazadone. The insomnia came full force and the trazadone was now only allowing me to get a few hours sleep, unlike before. I then tried sonata and restoril with no luck so went on remeron. The remeron 15mg worked for two weeks then pooped out. I went up to 30mg remeron hoping that would help, but it didn't. So I added the 150mg trazodone and no luck. Tonight I plan on going back down to 15mg remeron since I heard it loses its sedative effect at higher doses and continuing the 150mg trazadone. Maybe the 15mg with the 150mg will work unlike the 30mg of Remeron. I am praying it works, but must admit I am not that hopeful. My psychiatrist mentioned seroquel, but I was reluctant because I was on Abilify, another antipsychotic, for add on treatment for my depression and it made me very withdrawn. But at this point I feel I have no other option than to try the seroquel if I don't sleep again tonight. I am also going to see a sleep specialist next week. I am hoping there is something physically wrong with me like sleep apnea that is causing my insomnia, but I know that is probably not the case. Pretty sad that I'm hoping for sleep apnea huh? I just can't take this insomnia. I feel like no one I know has sleep problems and that there is something seriously psychologically wrong with me that I can't sleep even when taking powerful sleeping pills!! Has anyone found a miracle drug to help them sleep? By the way I fall asleep no problem, which I'm grateful for, I just wake up and can't get back to sleep for hours. It is so hard to function and act normal when I am so sleep deprived.
Believe me, YOU ARE NOT ALONE AT ALL. What a shame that having your daughter brought it on.
'Daz27041' wrote on '17:Hi Martin, Thanks very much for the welcome to the site. It's great, job well done mate! In relation to CBT, when I went to see a counsellor initially I was told that I would be treated with CBT, but alas as time went on, I wasn't. Other 'issues' which weren't an issue for me were discussed. I sometimes walked away from therapy thinking what an absolute load of hogwash. We just chit chatted about stuff in general, quite often not about me. I think the counsellor may have been digging for something which as I have said before, I don't think was there in the first place. I remember one session where my counsellor discussed 'success and what it means' and read to me from a document which I was to take home anyway. I wasn't there because I considered myself a failure, quite the opposite really. I was there because I couldn't sleep. I just think at the time there was nothing they could do so just went along with the chit-chat to kill off the hour. Even though my counsellor knew my main issue was sleeping and initially a depression, the only advice I got was as previously stated, “Don't worry about it, it will happen.” Gee thanks for the scoop! Real help. I really thought she thought that it would just go away. I was sleeping on and off when I was seeing her. The good point was she kept pointing out that I had an ability to cope perfectly fine with limited sleep, so I am thankful for that. I regret not saying that I was not getting anything from the sessions and that I thought we were discussing stuff that was not pertinent to my situation. So in answer to your question Martin I don't think I really got the CBT I thought I was going to get. I got no real advice in how to deal with it. I was promised some positive scripts about sleeping to read and say to myself, but they never came, even after several reminders ….
Now this Sleep Better Without Drugs booklet I have is a complete self help CBT program full of wonderful advice, facts, exposes myths, outlines strategies, tips, success stories, sleep diaries but most importantly gives you reassurance that you'll be OK. I love the section about getting your mind OK with not sleeping, I found that like a lifeboat whilst being cast adrift in the sea of insomnia.
Your first paragraph was wonderful and helpful for me (I can't afford CBT) but the second part wasn't. Sorry, but right now (at 68) all I can do is drugs. I will ask my doctor next time I go if I can consult a “sleep specialist”. I'm almost positive she will say not unless your foot the bill. My latest “worry” came from my work. They are cutting my hours back. That was good for 2 nights of very poor sleep. Thanks anyway for the effort.
'pjosbo' wrote on '17:Currently I am attending a workshop given by my insurance carrier, Kaiser Permanente, her in Virginia. The emphasis of the workshop is on the use of CBT for insomnia. It is led by a psychologist and the head of Kaiser's Sleep Medicine Department. What I find encouraging is that sleep doctors are now actively promoting CBT and are quite categorical that sleeping pills are not the long term solution for chronic insomniacs. I have come to the conclusion that my insomnia problem, which started 5 years ago has benn brought about by stress and other psychological factors. I am 68 years old and my specific problem is waking up too many times during the night. Overall I may get 4 to 7 hours total sleep but the interruptions have repercussions during the day – sluggishness, sleep deprivation, lack of motivation.I am hoping throught the workshop to learn more about what is going on during interrupted sleep and to develop “tricks” to “consolidate” my sleep (term used by sleep doctor. I am confident that the workshop with subsequent follow up with the doctor and/or psychologist will be of significant benefit.
Regards, Peter O.
Peter,
the problem with CBT is that it is unavailable to many people unless we pay for it ourselves. Since most of my sleep problems are related to money (or lack thereof) this treatment is only available to some.
'1949Molly' wrote on '17:Right now I can't even think of going without sleep all night. Real chicken, eh? I'm 67, with a part-time job and LOTS of stress and anxiety so I have no doubt why I can't sleep. But lately I have been saying to myself when I wake up in the middle of the night worried sick about any number of things – JUST LET IT GO!!! Most often the things I worry about are completely out of my control anyway.
For all:
Don't bother buying GABA (from a Health Food Store) I tried it last night and it worked just the opposite – woke me up.
'Daz27041' wrote on '16:Hi Molly,
Thanks for the welcome. I am lucky I suppose in the fact that I can get by with the minimal of medication. I only take it if I know there's going to be a second night of no sleep. One night I can handle. Two and the anxiety gets ramped up a bit and then I might take half an anti-anxiety tablet. When I was taking them full time, they worked wonderfully well for the first 3 weeks, then they lost their sleep inducing effect. I felt better mentally, so I stopped taking them about 6 weeks or so ago after being an anti-depressant/anti anxiety medication for almost a year. The Avanza that I take apparently works better in smaller doses, so I only take 15mg when needed. When I went off them I was on 30mg per night, but as I say, I think I have come a long way from then, even just being able to handle the sleepless nights. They are less stressful and hopefully will get even more so. You know a funny thing, I sleep the best when I say “Right, stuff it, I don't care if I sleep tonight, I've had enough.” Then miraculously, I sleep. I had that for about 3 weeks and thought, you beauty, I've kicked it and then whammo, out of left field, there it was again. Another all nighter for no good rhyme or reason and then things went off the rail again. For me, I have no known stressors, so I really don't know why this is happening to me. Later, in life I'll look back and think, wow, what happened there? 😀 All the best to you Molly
Right now I can't even think of going without sleep all night. Real chicken, eh? I'm 67, with a part-time job and LOTS of stress and anxiety so I have no doubt why I can't sleep. But lately I have been saying to myself when I wake up in the middle of the night worried sick about any number of things – JUST LET IT GO!!! Most often the things I worry about are completely out of my control anyway.
'PatO' wrote on '15:I can definitely understand your concerns over going multiple nights in a row with no sleep. I presently have chronic insomnia that effects me every night without exception. I keep a journal which lists the times I go to bed and get up in the morning (also when I am out of bed in the middle of the night). My reason for keeping a journal is because my doctor has placed me on “cognitive behavioral therapy”, and it helps to keep track of any progress. I have found that being on the therapy has helped limit the depression that is associated with insomnia, because it sets clear parameters to follow and gives me some hope of regaining a partial or complete ability to sleep normally. The program requires me to get out of bed and go into another area of the house If I am unable to sleep and then return to bed when I feel tired again. So far only limited success, but I must keep working at it. Welcome to the group
PatO,
I was very interested in your “cognitive behavioral therapy” as this treatment has been discussed a lot on this site. I for one would love to hear your entire experience with this. I could never afford to do it so second hand info is about all I'll get.
