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Steve – I don’t mind the questions at all! I actually made lists of questions during the week before I talked to Dr. Kat (I wanted to get my full $200 worth!) Sometimes I would ask the same question but just from another angle. When I felt completely satisfied with the answer, then I could finally relax. Most of them had to do with “what is normal” just like we’ve asked Martin and others here on the forum when practicing CBT-I. For me the biggest question was whether or not it was normal to have the light sleep. I asked it from different angles and then finally felt reassured that this was completely normal. This is what threw me off the first time doing ACT in March.
For myself, just having this one question answered has made all the difference and made it worth it to hire Dr. Kat. Also, just knowing that there was someone I could go to with all my questions, helped me relax and trust the process. I have one more session lined up with her this week, but so far, I have no questions! It may be my last session.
I started using an antidepressant back in April when I was at a really bad place. As a safeguard, I decided to remain on it until I’m completely over the insomnia. I don’t use a sleep window. I go to bed at the time I always did before the insomnia. I used to go to bed between 10:30 and 11:00 and would wake up between 7 and 7:30. Since I have the luxury of sleeping in if I need to because I have my own business, I just wake up naturally. My wake up time has tended to be a little later like 8 or 8:30 because with the light sleep I seem to need more time to sleep. I’m sure as my sleep gets back to normal, I’ll start waking up earlier.
I don’t use SC either. With this program the goal is to become comfortable with being in bed. When I don’t fall asleep I just lay there and relax, without worrying or struggling. The time actually seems to go fast. I think that’s because I’m probably in light sleep part of the time without even realizing it. One thing that has helped me is to just tell myself I’m going to bed to “rest” instead of “sleep” so that I can just accept whatever happens more easily.
I don’t know where you live, but all it takes is the internet to meet with the sleep doctor (not that you need to). She’s in England and I’m in Alabama.
ACT has turned out to be a lot easier than I thought. I’m entering the stage now where all I do is go to bed at a reasonable time and then do nothing. For the most part, I’m getting decent sleep and if I don’t, I don’t worry about it. Like you said, when you just don’t care anymore and stop worrying about sleep, then it comes naturally. When just starting, the program can be difficult though because there may be a few sleepless nights after giving up all the “props” – the things you’ve been depending on like sleeping pills and even SR. But once you get the hang of it, which I basically did the first time around, then it’s pretty simple.
Hi Max – it’s been a journey. I did SR twice for 2 months each time but was frustrated because I had 2 bad nights every week. When I heard of ACT and read the Sleep Book, I decided to give it a try. I really liked the approach of learning how to let go of anxiety, because I felt that my anxiety was always there lurking in the background. Back in March I tried ACT for a a few weeks. Almost immediately I began falling asleep, which was amazing because my insomnia is sleep onset. But my sleep was very light and I would wake up tired. I got confused and had no where to turn so eventually went back to SR which I did for another two months. Then recently I decided to try ACT again. This time I’m working with a sleep doctor from the Sleep School, where they specialize in the ACT approach. What I learned from the doctor that has been the most helpful to me is that my light sleep is normal. So it’s going well this time. I’m feeling more and more relaxed about sleeping. My sleep is still light but I’m managing to get enough sleep for the most part. I know that over time it will get better.
I’m not surprised that your sleep got better and better over time. You had learned how to relax again and trust in your ability to sleep, so it went back to normal.
So glad you’re doing well and thanks for the encouragement for all of us!
Hi Max – Congratulations and thanks so much for sharing your story! I came to this website about the same time as you and I was wondering how you were doing.
Borgesbi – If you haven’t already, you may want to read the Sleep Book, because it teaches techniques such as “mindfulness” and “welcoming” to calm down and then let go of the sensations and thoughts that come from sleep anxiety. I’ve used them and they work! I think that once you get the hang of them, then you won’t have to continue going through this cycle and eventually can nip the anxiety in the bud.
Hi Mr. Bernstein – here’s another approach you may want to check out as well. Read the book, The Sleep Book, by Guy Meadows. With this method you learn how to let go of your anxiety so that you naturally fall asleep.
Gdsmom – that’s awful that your husband is treating you in that way! It’s bad enough to have insomnia (I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy) but that then the one who is supposed to be supporting and loving you is calling you crazy. He’s supposed to help you get through this difficult time, not make it even worse. I’m very lucky that my husband is very kind and understanding. When I need a hug because I’m depressed or just so tired, I can go to him. Glad that you are coming to the forum and getting support here.
Glad you’re getting some good sleep, Steve. I’m doing better. The last two nights I fell asleep within a reasonable time. I was in and out of sleep all night, but I woke up feeling decent and good enough to do all my daytime activities. Just had a little less energy and got tired earlier than if I had had deep, refreshing sleep.
Hi Steve – I was wondering, are you getting close to your 5 hours of needed sleep these days?
I forgot to mention that I have the sessions with Dr. Kat using FaceTime. She probably uses other forms of video communication as well such as Skype or Zoom.
I’m hoping my light sleep will resolve too, through this therapy. I’ll keep everyone posted. It’s frustrating because if you don’t get the deeper sleep you need, you’re tired in the morning no matter how long you’ve slept. With the therapy, you strive to make peace with the tiredness during the day as well as with the light sleep at night, knowing that it is temporary. That’s because if you don’t make peace with it and accept it, it feeds the anxiety at night as you worry about how you’re going to feel the next day and then it reinforces the vicious cycle.
Hi Steve – the sessions are about $200 (150 in English dollars) for an hour. Not cheap! I’m hoping my insurance will cover some of this since she is a doctor, but I don’t know if they’ll pay for someone outside of this country. We worked out that the sessions would be divided into 2 half hour sessions so I could see her a little more often. I don’t really need a whole hour anyway. So instead of a session every two weeks (where a lot could go wrong!) I see her every week. I’ve sent her an email a couple times with questions or struggles and she has been responsive.
I was doing well with SR but was frustrated because basically for 4 months I averaged 5 good days a week and 2 bad. I know that Martin has talked about “holdouts” and that it just takes time for those bad nights to fade away. But it felt as though it could take a long time to finally recover completely. But more importantly for me, I felt like my anxiety was always there lurking in the background and I wanted to deal with this directly, which is what ACT does. Also, through this forum I’ve seen how others here have tried so hard to do SR & SC, but even after many months of practicing it they’re still struggling . I believe that’s because the underlying anxiety is still there.
Hi Steve and Everybody – I started to do ACT several weeks ago, but there were a bunch of starts and stops. It’s not easy, just like SR & SC aren’t. About 3 weeks ago I went ahead and scheduled some sessions with Dr. Kat Lederle to get some support. She works with Guy Meadows. My first week was difficult, being a combination of nights with light sleep, no sleep, and in and out of sleep all night. And there were nights when I gave up and took an Ambien, which of course doesn’t help in the long run. Everyday I’d wake up tired. Then I went on vacation for about a week. I didn’t want it completely ruined because of tiredness, so I took Ambien the whole time. Then I got home a week ago and got back on track.
It was hard to get back into it again, and the first night I was awake all night which I figured would probably happen. Since then it’s been a combination of the nights like the week before my vacation. But last night was very hopeful. I fell asleep right away for the first time in ages (my type of insomnia is sleep onset). For the rest of the night I was in and out of sleep with dreams that I remembered when I woke up. I’m tired again today, but hopeful.
I continue to have hope in this method because it addresses the anxiety directly. I’ve had some good talks with Dr. Kat and have learned some interesting things. I asked her if it was normal to have this light sleep all night. She said yes, and that research has been done that compared the brain activity during sleep of “normals” and those with insomnia. For those with insomnia, the amygdala, which controls the fight or flight response, is much more active. So unconsciously we are always on the alert, even if in our conscious mind we think we are relaxed. The goal of the therapy is to not only help us learn to relax consciously, but for the unconscious to eventually settle down as well. So far for me, the conscious part of myself is learning more and more to relax about sleep, but the unconscious part still has a ways to go.
I’m doing ok, Mac. I’m on vacation but unfortunately have had some bad days so I couldn’t enjoy myself like I would have liked to if I wasn’t so tired. Will get back into working at this when I get home next week.
Glad it’s going well for you, Pam.
How are you Steve, Delv, Daf, Borgesbi, Jazzcat and the rest of you? Everybody has been quiet lately. On vacation? I’ll be taking mine next week in Yellowstone Park. Hopefully all the hiking will put me right to sleep at night!
Thanks for the update, Mac. For myself, I don’t have much to report yet as far as any great results. Things take time, like you said, Mac. The week before last I was having the light sleep. Last week it changed and I was having more trouble just falling asleep. I haven’t been as consistent as I need to though, and know that slows down progress. I think overall though, that I’m feeling more relaxed about sleeping.
How about everybody else?
