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Congratulations gsdmom! That’s quite an accomplishment in itself going that long without pills! You are proof that you really don’t need them. Keep up the good work and hope your sleep really improves soon.
Deb – Yes, I was using the 5.5 and 6.0 hour SW when I was doing CBT-i. And yes, I agree about there being a honeymoon when you start a program but that goes for ACT as well as CBT-i. I am just getting frustrated I guess because I did make progress in that first week of ACT and now I have run into problems it seems. Part of me does feel better. I seem to have more energy and I’m not as weak in the muscles but other parts, such as concentration and eyestrain/eye muscles seem to be a little worse, if not the same. I will stay the course as total SR/SC was not helping me anymore. But I am not going to increase my SW further right now. I will keep it at 7.0 to 7.5 depending on how tired I am at night. I know I need 8 hours of sleep as that is what I did before insomnia, but I will work my way up to that. Thanks for your encouragement and thoughts Deb. I really appreciate it.
I thought I’d post here and let others give their opinions to me. Since I am no longer keeping a sleep diary, I really have no idea how long I am sleeping. Saturday night I thought I slept fairly well but as the day went on Sunday, I started to drag and became zombiesh. I couldn’t wait to go to bed because of the way I felt. Last night, I increased my SW to 7.5 hours because it was slightly over a week since I adjusted it last. I realized during the night that my sleep is becoming fragmented again and I am no longer getting the 3 to 4 hour deep sleep I was getting when I had a SW of around 6 hours. I know with ACT, we are to accept what sleep we get and to relax in bed when we are awake. We also can stay in bed for the amount of sleep we think we need, which for me pre-insomnia was 8 hours. Last night I woke up at 3:30 and stayed awake until it was time to get up (5:15). I was pretty much relaxed and wasn’t tossing and turning any and in fact, almost nodded off a couple times but quickly jerked myself awake. I accepted that I probably wasn’t going to get any more sleep and so just used my tools to stay relaxed and then let my mind wander, which is how I almost nodded off a couple times. I feel okay this morning and at least so far, a lot better than yesterday. I am going to stay with ACT in terms of tools and all but I am wondering if I should stay with ACT in terms of staying in bed for that 7.5 hours or should I go back to SR and use a much shorter SW of around 5.5 or 6 hours in order to get that deep sleep again? Or will doing that destroy what I have achieved under ACT? Right now, I would say I am taking about 30 to 45 minutes to fall asleep, maybe longer, then sleeping for about an hour to an hour and a half and then waking up and repeating the process. Whatever I end up doing, as long as I am not tossing and turning, I am not doing SC. That added so much stress to my nights it was unbelievable.
Deb – I know what you mean about having a meltdown over disappointment with your sleep. I haven’t had a meltdown yet but I do get really disappointed after trying SR and ACT and it takes so long to work. I know others are in the same boat. That’s why I think it is important for us to share our thoughts on this forum and thank Martin for providing it for us.
Deb, it’s a good thing you tried ACT again. I’m not sure I would have done so. I think I might have been happy with the 5 good nights/2 bad nights you were getting. But then I can understand how we all want them to be all good nights as well. I am glad you are cured.
Glad to hear it Borgesbi. I’m glad you are getting better sleep. I no longer keep a sleep diary either. But I do get poor nights of sleep even though when i wake, I am completely relaxed in bed. A couple of times I wake up with anxiety but I can use the tools to calm down right away. Last night was a little quirky. I know it took a while for me to fall asleep and I thought I got some good sleep but this morning, as the day went on, it felt like those nights when I only got about 2 hours sleep. I was dragging and a little zombiesh. Still, I am accepting what happened and am looking forward to tonight’s sleep. Last night I went to bed so that I would be in bed 7.5 hours. I’m not sure if that was a mistake or not. I might go back to 7.0 hours tonight. Good luck to you with your sleep.
Hi Suren. I think a lot of us were in the same boat as you with CBT-i and so we tried ACT to supplement it. I have not had a refreshing sleep since I first got insomnia about 10 months ago. In answer to your question, I am posting two links about ACT that should give you the information you need about the differences between the two methods. There are a lot of similarities between the two but there are some major differences. Hope this clarifies things for you. Also, note that you may read this late as sometimes when links are posted in the message, it has to be cleared by Martin. https://contextualscience.org/acceptance_and_commitment_therapy_for_insomnia_act
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https://contextualscience.org/files/ACT%20for%20Insomniacs.%20Meadows.pdfThanks Borgesbi. I’ll check it out. How are you doing with ACT by the way? Are you sleeping any better? I know you have less anxiety, as do I. I just need some more sleep.
Suren – A lot of us used to do a lot of things we can’t do now that we have insomnia. I, too, used to fall asleep for an hour or so while watching TV around 5:00 on a Saturday and then have no trouble sleeping at night. Or falling asleep in a chair watching TV Friday evening for several hours and then getting up to go to bed and sleeping with no problem. Those days might come back but first we have to follow some rules to become a normal sleeper again.
I do watch TV for my wind down time. Martin says as long as you’re more than 10 to 15 feet away from the TV screen, and the screen is not in your bedroom, then it’s okay to watch. I usually watch the last episode of Frasier which ends at 10 and then I start getting right into bed. I should have said that you should not be watching something overly stimulating that’ll get your heart beating fast. Just a TV show that is nice and relaxing.
I do watch TV for my wind down time. Martin says as long as you’re more than 10 to 15 feet away from the TV screen, and the screen is not in your bedroom, then it’s okay to watch. I usually watch the last episode of Frasier which ends at 10 and then I start getting right into bed.
Hi featherly. Actually, I have been grouping all of those surgery thoughts under “the Science Guy” and have been welcoming him both day and night with all of his scientific theories about why I have insomnia. He still pushes through though and so I pay extra attention to welcoming him and telling my brain that “I’ve heard that story before and it’s time to move on”.
In answer to your question, I use a 7 hour sleep window although it’s more like a little more than 7 as I start getting ready for bed 15 minutes before my 7 hour window. I want to make sure I am in bed before that 7 hour window begins so my SW is more like 7 hours and 10 minutes.
While I may have posted about that “pinging” last night and how it disturbed me, I actually feel quite good today. I no longer clock watch so I can’t really keep a sleep diary to see how long I have been sleeping. I just go by how good I feel the next day. I still have soreness in the eye muscles and have trouble focusing, but the headaches caused by the insomnia are a lot less and sometimes don’t come on until the end of the day. My leg muscles don’t seem as tired today as well. I am going to try to get in a hike a little while from now to get some exercise in. I probably won’t have time for a motorcycle ride as it is supposed to rain later on. But all in all, I am feeling better than I was a couple weeks ago.
Suren – I gave a reply to your post but it is awaiting moderators approval since it contains a link. In the meantime, you can go to bed under ACT even if not sleepy. Also, they to practice tools during the day. It will help you more at night.
I had a strange thing happen to me last night that reminded me so much of the first night I got insomnia. On that first night, I felt a “pinging” go off in my head and I immediately woke up at 2:00 in the morning. I never slept well again and that was 10 months ago. Last night, I was in a dream state and knew it and that same “pinging” occurred and immediately woke me up. I haven’t had that happen since it first happened 10 months ago. I got really scared after it happened last night but I started immediately using the ACT tools and I did get back to sleep for an hour or so. Maybe a little more. That settled me down some when I got up this morning because I remember the first night it happened, I didn’t get any sleep after. I have no idea what that “pinging” can be but it’s scary so I hope I don’t get it again. Maybe it has happened since that first night as I still do awake suddenly and maybe I just don’t realize it’s happening. Anyway, that is why I sometimes think my insomnia is being caused by something physical in my head rather than stress and anxiety. Who knows? Have to stop thinking like that though. Hope everyone slept well last night.
You.re probably right featherly. I think I will wait another couple of days before I adjust it further.
Glad to hear you are getting better nights of sleep gsdmom! Just keep using the tools and those sleepless nights should start going away. I am having trouble myself but overall, am sleeping a little better and feeling a little better the next day since I started doing ACT. One question for you again. How long are you staying in bed? What time do you go to bed at night? The same time every night?
