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Yes Hopeless, everything you mention is becoming part of a ritual for you that is perpetuating your insomnia. Do you know anything about ACT? I suggest you get The Sleep Book written by Dr. Guy Meadows. It’s a quick read and will explain everything in there that we have been talking about in this thread.
Hi everyone. I see you are all checking in so I will do the same. I received my CPAP machine last Tuesday and I do think it has helped me some. But I also seem to have settled in to a rut. I go to bed and fall asleep relatively quickly. Then I wake up after about an hour. I use the bathroom and come back to bed and fall asleep rather quickly again. I then sleep until about 3:30 and from there, I can’t seem to fall back asleep again. Sometimes I do but it’s rare. I use the tools and I do get into a more restful state and I sometimes almost drift off. But my mind brings me back to being wide awake again. So mostly I get about 5 to 6 hours of sleep and maybe 6 to 7 on a really good night but with the good night comes a lot of early awakenings. But it’s never enough and I never feel refreshed in the morning. I do see positive signs however, as I am not getting the headaches the next day that I used to get. And my concentration is better. Dizzyness is still a problem though.
I am having a problem trying to figure something out and maybe one of you can help me. I know we are supposed to stay in a positive move and keep saying positive affirmations to ourselves. And I do feel like my insomnia is going to clear up soon and I look forward to going to bed to see if I will get a better sleep that night. But I also know we are supposed to go to bed accepting whatever happens and not expecting to sleep. So isn’t that a contradiction? How can I go to bed feeling positive and upbeat and knowing my insomnia will end soon but also go to bed not expecting to sleep? It’s hard to reconcile the two emotions. I have just been recognizing and accepting both thoughts and then just lying there and letting what happens happen.
Borgesbi – Boy, do I know what you mean about sleeping in until 9am on the weekends! I sure miss those days. I used to get really disappointed that I slept so late on a weekend and frittered away the Saturday morning when I could have been up and out doing something. I get up early Saturday now but not by choice and it’s hard to do something because I am usually still tired.
Hi Pam. Those are reasonably accurate times although I say “around” because they don’t happen at the same time every night. Some times I see the clock when I get back from the bathroom but other times I will look at it. With ACT, it’s okay to look at the clock. It’s how you react to it that matters as described in the book. I am okay with whatever time it is. In fact, in that regard, I am like a normal sleeper in that when I see it is 3:30, I say “Oh good! I still have an hour and 45 minutes to sleep” instead of “Oh no, I only have an hour and 45 minutes left, how will I cope?”. Frankly, it never bothered me to look at the clock especially when I was doing a sleep diary as I was always a poor estimator with time so if I wanted an accurate diary, I had to look at the clock.
How are you doing with your sleep? Did it improve last night any? I hope so.
Maybe it’s time for an update from everyone. Since my rough patch last week, I seem to have settled into a sleep pattern. I am in bed by about 9:10 and it takes me about 15 minutes to fall asleep. I then wake up about an hour later and I get up to go to the bathroom. I come back to bed and fall asleep relatively quickly. I then usually sleep till about 2:30 with maybe one wake-up in that 10:30 to 2:30 period. But again, that wake-up doesn’t always happen but when it does, it is short and I can usually get back to sleep pretty quickly. I then go back to sleep rather quickly around 2:30 and sleep till around 3:30 but from that point, I am fully awake and I just rest comfortably until the alarm goes off at 5:15. I do have some unwanted thoughts and anxiety feelings after 3:30 but I can usually welcome them and they don’t bother me after that so I’m not sure why I can’t get back to sleep after 3:30. So over that 8 hour time span, I have about 4 wake-ups with that final wake-up at 3:30. All of this means that the thing that is killing my sleep is that last hour and 45 minute to 2 hour sleep period that I can’t sleep in. And since I’m not full of anxiety or unwanted thoughts, I’m not sure why I can’t sleep during this time. I guess I still need to retrain my brain.
I’m sorry about the length of this post but I had one other observation. I do have sleep apnea and I wear an oral appliance for it. However, I noticed it’s not working as well as it once did and I can only sleep in two positions before I feel the soft tissues in the back of my throat closing up. This would be on my back with my head turned to the extreme left or on my left side. I wake up sore from only sleeping in these two positions and since we with insomnia are light sleepers, I am wondering if the soreness and apnea are causing me to wake up more or get a less deeper sleep. So, I had my doctor write me a prescription for a CPAP machine and I should get it in the next day or two. After I get used to sleeping with it, I am wondering if it will help me sleep better. Does anyone here use a CPAP machine? What kind of mask are you using?
Pam – Yes, it will take a while for those of us not “cured” yet to be “cured”. gsdmom is correct. It can take some months to achieve and there will be some bad nights in there while you are achieving it. Just keep using the tools to work on welcoming and getting to know your unwelcome thoughts and urges. I have had some bad nights as well. Strangely, for me, the fatigue and tiredness doesn’t bother me anymore. It’s the headaches that come with lack of sleep that are very bothersome for me. I am using the tools to get to know the headaches and successfully live with them like I have done with all of my other symptoms. I know I am sleeping more again after that rough patch of last week but I just don’t know how deep the sleep is. I know that has an effect. Anyway, hang in there and keep posting. I’ll be glad to give you support when you need it!
gsdmom – Yes, I suspect the high sleep drive is some of it. Last night I also slept 6+ hours but there were about 4 or 5 wake-ups in there. Also, I usually get a better sleep on a Friday night because I am tired from the work week. My problem is that although I feel “okay” in the morning, I don’t feel refreshed. I also notice that my oral appliance I have been wearing to treat my sleep apnea doesn’t work as well so I can only sleep in two positions without sleep apnea affecting me. The result is I am getting sore from constantly sleeping in those two positions and that might be affecting my sleep. My doctor is prescribing me a CPAP machine and I will try that out soon. Hopefully that will lead to less awakenings.
Tuesday night was the completion of my fourth week on ACT. It has been a strange week. Monday night I slept between 1 and 2 hours. Tuesday night I slept between 6 and 7 hours. Wednesday I slept for only an hour and last night I again slept between 6 and 7 hours. The nights after the short sleeps were rough but I was functional the next day. I also took to heart what Dr. Kat told Burn when she said he was programming when he told himself he would survive the next day when he was having a bad sleep. I don’t tell myself those things anymore. When something like that pops into my mind, I acknowledge the thought but don’t try to challenge it. Just like “Noticing the thought” exercise where you notice the thought and then go back to what you were doing. Today I really practiced Noticing Your Feelings and Urges as I am now starting to recognize the value and reasons for these tools. That exercise will get me comfortable with the symptoms that insomnia gives me so I don’t worry about them and blow them up out of proportion the next day when I am awake. I think that’s the key for me as I really suffer with some of these symptoms.
Hi Deb – I did try your 30 minute “Learn to relax” technique over the weekend. I guess I was too relaxed because I kept falling to sleep for a couple minutes.
Another question for you. As I said, I do understand your “acceptance” as being willing to not sleep this night and the next night and the next. That’s probably the best definition of acceptance that you gave me and it helps me a lot. But did you also maintain a positive mood that ACT would work eventually or didn’t that concern you in practicing Acceptance?
Well, I said that I am starting to alternate between having good nights and bad nights and last night was the bad night. A very bad night. I am a zombie today. I got to sleep okay but was up after an hour or two and then was awake the rest of the night. And I don’t mean in and out of sleep. I mean wide awake. I tried letting my mind wander and I welcomed some unwelcome thoughts that cam to me but to no avail. I did almost nod off a couple of times but quickly awoke. I didn’t toss and turn except for the occasional turn to prevent soreness but mostly, I just lay there for the entire night in a restful and peaceful state trying to let my mind drift. I am starting to wonder if the good sleep I get on alternate nights is due mainly to sleep drive building up. Still, I will persevere with the tools and total acceptance of my insomnia. Hope everyone else had a good sleep.
Deb – That is a wonderful explanation of acceptance. I thought I was accepting of my insomnia but not to the point of ready to forgo sleep night after night. I will try looking at it that way starting tonight.
Burn – I think what Dr. Kat meant was that you were thought challenging, Like when we do The Thinker exercise and just notice the thought and maybe a one or two word description and nothing more. Last night, I did the same thing as you did and I noticed the thought and told myself I would be okay the next day. But I shouldn’t have done that as that was a form of thought challenging. I should have just noticed the unwelcome thought that I would feel bad (if the thought came around) and welcomed it and that is all. By telling myself I would be okay was challenging the thought that I wouldn’t be okay, and the problem with that you can read about in the book on Page 124 – 126. And if you told yourself that without the thought coming to mind, then you opened yourself up to an unwelcome thought that you wouldn’t have.
I see the title of this thread was changed and the amount of posts shortened. Probably because all we do is talk about ACT now. Also, I think Ellen’s message was delayed because she is talking about something I wrote a while back. Anyway, I thank Martin for letting us ACT people congregate here. This is virtually the only place I know of to go for ACT support. Glad to see we have a lot of people getting better, Holiday is over. Back to the grind. I hope I can sleep tonight with added pressure of knowing I have to get up for work tomorrow. One more unwelcome thought I need to welcome. lol.
Hi Deb. Overall, I do think I am improving. Some nights are better than others like last night, I am pretty sure I got about 6 to 6.5 hours of sleep and the first 4.5 to 5.0 was consecutive. The rest was broken up but I did get to sleep. I seem to be like some people here and am alternating good nights with bad nights. My concern is that even though I am getting more sleep, I still have trouble concentrating on things the next day and focusing on things with my eyes. But the headaches I was getting in doing SC are pretty much gone so I will just continue doing with what I am doing and hope the sleep gets better and more consistent. If I start sleeping normally again and I still have trouble concentrating and focusing my eyes, I’ll go back to the doctor then. Glad you are doing really well. That seems to be both you and Borgesbi that have been cured by ACT.
Burn/Borgesbi – I think if you contacted Martin he would exchange your e-mail addresses and you can take it from there. But I wouldn’t post any identifying info or your e-mail address directly to the forum.
Burn – I wish I could help you Burn but I don’t know myself. Last night was a rough one for me. I fell asleep for my usual 3 hours and then woke up. I tried welcoming any unwelcome thoughts but there weren’t too many to welcome. I just felt totally relaxed except for a little anxiety now and then. I could feel the tingling of the anxiety and when I welcomed it, the feeling went away. But I still couldn’t sleep. I lay there and I’m sure I drifted in and out of Phase I sleep for three hours or so. I just don’t know if I am supposed to wake myself up fully and try to welcome any thoughts and urges or lay there like I did and just be restful. I didn’t “try” to go to sleep. I just lay there in a restful and peaceful state without tossing and turning but the result was the same, which was about three hours of drifting in and out of phase I sleep. The result is another day of not too bad fatigue, but the inability to focus my eyes and a general lack of the ability to concentrate. Friday night I had a relatively good sleep but then I usually do because Fridays I am very tired from a full week of work.
