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Hi!
First of all, let me express my sympathies for the suffering you are going through. But what is really the problem here? IMO, trying to use cbti as some kind of magic sleeping pill or an academic formula to escape that which makes you feel extremely uncomfortable, which is insomnia or simply a phobia of having poor sleep. Well it just doesn’t work like that.
Assess how this statement makes you feel: “There is really nothing you can do to make sleep happen.” If you,
1. Chuckle and just shrug it off. Congratulations! You very likely don’t or won’t have insomnia.
2. Feel nervous, despair, defeated, anxious or any of those unpleasant feelings. Well, you still have something to work on. Actually coming to terms with it.Note that people in category 1 don’t necessarily sleep a lot better than 2. It just means they are indifferent to the same set of symptoms. They don’t spend hours thinking about it. Recovery from insomnia doesn’t mean free from insomnia. It just means they have abandoned the struggle with it.
I go by an earliest bed time or the latest. If I am really sleepy by 10pm, or still not sleepy by midnight, I climb into bed regardless. Then I either fall asleep straightaway or wait until I do. I want to be ready in bed to ride the sleepiness wave when it arrives and not be up and about doing things. I did try, for how long I can go without sleep, mine is around 36 hours regardless how much I wanted to soldier on or how anxious I was. I just can’t make it past 1.5 days without sleep no matter how hard I tried! So worrying about going for days without sleep is pointless, it is impossible to me and my body just won’t allow it
You can’t stop what is part of your nature. Thinking is a normal part of a healthy brain. Normal sleepers take anywhere between 15-30 mins to fall asleep anyway, so in that time, there’ll be plenty to think about. Of course, if you are really sleepy, you’ll be out in much less time. Let your own body guide you, when sleepy, there’ll be nothing unmistakable about it, heavy eyelids, head nodding off, difficulty concentrating etc. If you have none of these, it just means you are not sleepy yet. Or the body doesn’t need to sleep at that point. It doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong either. Sleep will come at some point after being awake long enough. No ifs ands or buts. In the meantime if you find yourself in this situation, you can either get up and do something enjoyable or stay in bed and well, think. There’s no wrong choice here and it’s up to you which you prefer.
You should also make choices about sleep as if sleep isn’t the main factor but because that’s what you really want. In regards to physical symptoms, my feeling is that they should go away over time. Mine did. Unless of course you have an underlying medical issue that causes them. Recovered insomniacs aren’t necessarily sleeping a lot better or that insomnia has left them. It just means we have abandoned the struggle and are much more open to having wakefulness and not struggle as much than those who do. Good luck!
Hi Tess!
What used to work before should work now. Because nothing really changed except your thoughts! Don’t approach cbti as if it’s a magic pill that guarantees sleep. It isn’t. It’s more like a crutch you use to help you get back on your feet but should be abandoned when it’s done its job.
Hello Tess!
Welcome to this forum. So what was his sleep window before he ‘developed’ insomnia? I use ‘ ‘ because nobody ever lost the ability to sleep. It’s usually the thoughts towards sleep that has. And therefore the brain thinks that something is wrong when nothing is. I always recommend going back to your habits and patterns during pre-insomnia days. Try to regain your personality and identity as much as you can. To get as nonchalant and indifferent about sleep as you can because this is the state where you want to return to. When you no longer obsess over sleep, spend hours of your waking hours thinking about it, or make decisions about your everyday life around it, you will do a lot better.
If it’s only the first week, and this is the sleep window you want to keep to, I recommend sticking to it. Try to not make the focus too much on the end result, ie sleep, focus on other things like enriching your daily life with memorable experiences, doing the things you love and spending time with your loved ones. The sleep will take care of itself in the end. Your body will regulate itself if you just allow it.
The mental work that goes into ‘fixing’ insomnia is a significant part because insomnia is mainly a mental issue. It is usually a result of overthinking, overdoing and over monitoring. Reframing your mindset around insomnia is key. Be simply okay with wakefulness. When you find yourself having to make a choice, do as if you don’t have insomnia and sleep isn’t the main consideration. When you no longer fear insomnia, it has no control over you. There is no one way to do this so you need to find a narrative that fits you best. Some people do meditation, others write positive sleep affirmations or yet others use metaphors. Say for example, if you are unhappy just because you only have $6 in your bank account, it still doesn’t change this fact. But if you look at it in another way, say, you have a roof over your head, enough food to eat and your basic needs are taken care of, that $6 becomes insignificant. The thought then fades away and your bank balance just is a number. Do like this for sleep, if you are optimistic about life, are happy where you are and what you do, then how many hours you sleep really doesn’t matter. It becomes just a number. Good luck and best wishes to you all.
Hello guys! Thank you for being here and for participating. Yes insomnia can feel debilitating. The urge to find companions in a common struggle like this can be overwhelming. I don’t want to sound like an a** but allow me to explain why this is not the right approach. When you try to do this, it then becomes okay to have insomnia because you seek safety in numbers, right? What do you really want to achieve by reading about other people’s insomnia? Are you supposed to feel better because theirs are worse or could you get frightened over it because it could happen to you? It’s a double edged sword and it can go either way. Imagine someone being told they have cancer, are they supposed to feel consolation when they are then told millions too suffer from it?
I don’t know about you guys but self reflection might be a better approach. Sit quietly with yourself and really ponder the deeper issues involved and eventually coming to terms with it. There is no one way to do this, I encourage you to find a narrative that fits you and which you can relate to. Keep an open mind and be optimistic. I’ll admit though that reading stories about how other people overcame their insomnia might be sources of inspiration. Good luck!
I wanna add too that you slept well before because you were largely ignorant about it. Ignorance is bliss when it comes to sleep. Now that sleep has come under your radar, indifference becomes your cure. Try to ignore it and get on with your life. It’s really not a big deal, you must have had many bouts of insomnia in your life before this but they are all conveniently forgotten now. The point is nothing about your ability to sleep has changed, it’s still there and will stay with you for life. It’s just your thinking toward sleep that has.
Hi Robb
Great for you. The desire to improve is a common starting point. Although I might want to caution you about “right” or “wrong” things. When you are recovered, these things just don’t matter anymore. Because they really don’t affect your sleep in any significant way. Nothing you think or do really impacts your sleep, at least not permanently. The body will regulate itself if you just let it. You will find many different scenarios where you’ll be up for different reasons. If you find yourself sleepless because you were worried about some thing, including sleep itself, then it’s becomes quite unpleasant. Or if you are staying up because you really want to, like chasing a drama series or out partying, it’ll be pleasant. Ultimately, it’s up to you how you evolve your thinking about sleep thereby how you evolve your way out of insomnia. In simple terms, this boils down into a time management issue and how you prioritize sleep in each 24 hour day. When you are back to yourself like before, you will likely revert to your old sleeping habits and sleeping whenever you feel like it. And there’s really nothing wrong with that! Good luck.
Hi Robb!
I am sorry to hear about your recent struggles. I am sure you are doing something to address your sleep troubles already. You probably already know the importance of regular bedtimes so probably do not need reminding now. Other than that, I can only say to let nature run its course which usually settles down on its own. It is interesting when you say you have hopes for everything to be as it was before. And that’s really the key! So what did you use to do before? What were your bed time routines and your bed times? Try to regain your personality and identity as much as you can in this aspect. It also means if you are taking pills to sleep now when you never did before, you might need to work out a plan to taper off them. Take it easy and one step at a time. Be kind to yourself and try not to be easily discouraged because you are seeing results you want or fast enough. I also encourage you to explore what is it about poor sleep that you fear and dislike so much about. Your true chance of a real and lasting recovery will depend on how you change your mindset around that. Good luck!
Hello! I’m just a bit curious here. How exactly does having a DARE buddy help you cure yourself of an anxiety centred around sleep? 🤔
It’s good to hear you are still resting after waking up. So my question then is have you researched biphasic sleep? It means you divide your sleep period into two distinct segments. You can look up, Biphasic Sleep: What It Is And How It Works, in google and an article by the sleep foundation, which is fact-checked, explains what it is and how it works. Apparently, it is really common among humans and other animals alike to sleep like this. A lot of normal sleepers wake up after sleeping for 3-5 hours, myself included. That first part of sleep is usually quite deep, when I would pass out and remember nothing about it until I woke up. Then I would get up, use the toilet and go back to bed to sleep for the second part. The later part is characterized by more light sleep, lots of vivid dreams and a lot of morning glories if you are male too. I heard this is when most of REM sleep occurs because dreaming happens more. So if I told you that what you are experiencing is actually quite normal, would you feel more at ease? Don’t fight the wake ups, accept them and move on. After waking up, going back to bed is your first choice to try to see if you can fall back asleep. Otherwise, you could get up and do something light and non strenuous and try again after an hour. I read most people in pre-industrial age actually did this so perhaps what you experience is just an remnant of what people used to do then. Good luck.
Hello!
When you woke up at 330-400 what did you usually do? Get up and start your day or just continue lying in bed?
Hello and welcome to this forum!
You asked a good question and it was something I asked myself when I had insomnia but felt very sleepy during the day outside my sleeping hours so I wondered if it was okay to take naps since my body obviously wanted it but cbti says naps are strictly forbidden. Also, the way you are asking it is as if it is wrong to take naps and you will get “punished” for it at night. I felt the same at the time too. My answer to myself now and to you is naps are okay, it really doesn’t hurt your nightly sleep as long as it is reasonable. Don’t beat yourself up over it, take the nap when you feel sleepy during the day and nobody is blaming or punishing you for it. Who says not being able to sleep that well at night just because you took an afternoon nap is bad?? It’s your anxious mind that puts that narrative there, you begin to readily believe such nonsense and hereby unnecessarily derived yourself of such a simple pleasure in life.
I now occasionally take naps and still sleep great at night too. I really don’t care what kind of sleep I get at night or how naps might affect my nightly sleep. I think because of that, I continue to sleep great. I have no taboo and I don’t limit myself in any way. Strict rules are not necessary and make no sense. Research already shows power naps improve performance and memory so that’s all I need to know. I seem to do better after naps and I get refreshed and energized. I feel like I could run a marathon after taking a nap so how is that bad? Therefore, please enjoy your siesta. Leave the nightly sleep to the nights. Just listen to your body, if it needs to sleep, it will tell you by making you sleepy.
