[Chee2308]

Hello!
What is your current sleep window like? How many hours are you sleeping on average every night?

Regression is extremely common for any recovery in progress. Think about it. If you are sleeping better and longer, your sleep drive is then naturally reduced and you find it harder to fall and stay asleep. This coupled by the surprise and bewilderment why this is happening compounds the problem further. Stick with the program the best you can and give your body time to respond and over time, it will. Expect regressions to happen because the more you get, the less affected you become by them. By getting more accustomed to difficult nights, you should start becoming less anxious and then you start sleeping better again. Resist the temptation to “tweak” anything or trying more sleep efforts in an attempt to get more sleep because then you start monitoring for results and that often can lead to backfiring and more frustrations when everything fails. The less you do, the better. Good luck!

[Chee2308]

Hello!
How long have you had insomnia and what was your sleep window like before this? If it’s different from now, it may be likely your body isn’t used to the current sleep window yet. And any reason why you chose 4 am as your get out of bed time? 4 am is probably still very dark, I think 6 am would be more preferable. This is because after you get out of bed, you should try to get some sunlight exposure to reinforce it. The human body is regulated by an internal body clock and a circadian rthym where light plays a large role. I think a sleep window of 12-6 am might be more appropriate for you, unless you are a shift worker and need to work in the early morning. Good luck!

[Chee2308]

Hello Gabriel
I still am reading a lot of sleep monitoring going on! Using an app that supposedly tells you how you slept, what kind of sleep you got and whether you are getting any deep sleep etc, all of these are suggesting you are trying to control sleep which is impossible! Nobody can control sleep. After you’ve fallen asleep, your body does its thing just like digestion happens after eating your meals. Realise it is completely useless and futile to control or monitor your sleep simply because it is impossible and which serves no useful purpose either because it doesn’t help you to sleep well in the future. A complety pointless and aimless exercise. Like I said, less is more when it comes to sleep and absolutely nothing is best! With regards to your question about not sleeping the entire night, I realise the answer for me to get my sleep is this: Not sleeping. That’s the irony about sleep! Not sleeping (especially for longer periods) will get your body to fall asleep faster and deeper. Sleep is entirely self-regulating so letting go of complete control is key. Also if you go to youtube and look up a channel called Insomnia Insight hosted by a sleep coach called Daniel Erichsen, he talks about sleep as being a “gas and brake” model where gas is sleep drive and brake is a phenomenon called hyperarousal. Watch Insomnia Insight #356, the Bermuda Triangle effect will help you understand more about hyperarousal and how to reduce it. Good luck!

[Chee2308]

Hello Edgar!
I read about your posts and truly feel sorry for you. If you go to youtube and search this guy named Daniel Erichsen and his podcast called insomnia insight, he has put up a lot of videos talking about insomnia which he refers to as a “gas and brake” model. The gas part is basically sleep drive and the brake hyperarousal. I think you are too hyperaroused and that may have been a product over years of mind conditioning. Watch podcast Insomnia Insight #356 – the Bermuda Triangle effect. I think you might benefit from that.

[Chee2308]

Hello Gabriel!
Are you constantly checking the time when you wake? If so, please stop doing this immediately! Resist the temptation to look at the clock and trying to figure how much you slept. Clock watching is very anxiety producing for people with sleeping problems. So the only time you look at the clock is ideally one hour before bed, then settle into your one hour relaxation period before bedtime and then you don’t check the clock anymore. You then either go to bed because you start feeling sleepy, with heavy eyes/difficulty staying focused reading/watching tv OR you feel the time is right. After you gone to bed, do not check the clock when you are woken up. All you know is that the alarm hasn’t gone off and you just go back to bed and try to sleep if your body wants it. Go timeless. Monitor and check absolutely nothing.

[Chee2308]

Hello Lee!
Occasional sleep disruption is very common and everyone gets them once in a while. But sleep usually gets back on track once the event or stressor causing the sleep disruption has passed or is removed. If you continue to experience insomnia after that, it is usually because you have started thinking about sleep and are taking steps to “fix” it by making modifications to your sleep routine (sleeping in or going to bed earlier) and adjusting your daily life to focus on getting more sleep. Do you now have a consistent go to bed and get out of bed time? Are you also taking naps during the day and sleep medications to help you sleep? From now on, stop ALL sleep efforts and have consistent sleep timetable. If you are currently taking medications, consult with your doctor on a tapering off plan. Set a get out of bed time based on your lifestyle and from that, by allowing a 6 hour sleep window, you get your go to bed time. That will be your earliest time to go to bed and try not to nap during the day. Always get out of bed at that fixed time no matter how much you slept. Then when you start sleeping better, try increasing your time in bed by going to bed earlier in 15 minutes intervals until you arrive at a magic number that works for you because everyone is a bit different. Most people generate 6-8 hours of sleep after being awake for 16-18 hours. You’ll have to experiment to find your magic number. Understand that sleep is just a core biological process your body goes through after being awake long enough. Nothing including sleeping pills can generate sleepiness EXCEPT staying awake long enough. Sleep drive works a lot like hunger and both accumulate from not sleeping/eating long enough. You may also find after sleeping well or longer, you may start having difficult nights again and this is normal! It is a sign you are sleeping well and your sleep drive is getting less. Your body will slowly adjust to the new sleep schedule as long as you are patient and give it time to respond. Good luck, we all here will be wishing you the best and we hope to hear your success story in a few short weeks!

[Chee2308]

Hello Gabriel,
I am reading a lot of sleep efforts! Because you are constantly changing things, your mind is constantly monitoring for results and when something doesn’t work, you then get frustrated and that perpetuates the cycle of sleep disruption. From this point on, just do one thing only, whatever single thing you think is helping you the most and stick to it. If it doesn’t help then abandon it and do nothing! Sleep is not something you need to do a ton of things to achieve. It is natural and effortless. Did Covid mess with your head and “damage” something? Well nobody knows, not even the scientists so why should you even bother?? The problem is beyond you and has happened. So focus on the present and just do this one thing: Go and get out of bed at the same time every day. At first, allow a 6 hour sleep window with no naps and no sleeping in. Make this consistent for at least 2 weeks and your body should adjust to the new sleep window. If it is safe where you live, go out more in the morning to get sunshine because light plays a very big role in realigning your circadian rhythm and try to stay active throughout the day. One hour before bedtime, try doing something relaxing like having a warm shower, a nice cup of hot chocolate, watch your favourite tv series or anything you find enjoyable. Then go to bed with no expectations. Tell yourself you might sleep, which is great, or you might not, which is also okay because there will be endless opportunities for sleep in future. Either outcome is okay and you don’t really care anymore. Over time you become less attached to the outcome and you will begin to loosen your grip on trying to control sleep. Then when you are sleeping great for a week or 10 days or so, try adjusting your sleep window to allow more time in bed in 15 mins increments. Take note your body will react to this by waking up more or take onger to fall asleep because you are making adjustments and this automatically makes the mind start monitoring for results. Also, when you are sleeping more, the harder it will get for your body to fall asleep because you are no longer as sleep deprived as before. So expect all this to happen and there’s no surprise when you get a difficult night or two. But be consistent with any sleep window for at least 10 days to give time for your body to respond. If you find your sleep getting worse, then reduce time in bed and vice versa. Find that number that works for you where you can fall asleep pretty quickly and wake up not feeling as tired or groggy. Actually waking up a bit groggy is normal and everyone has it. It is also normal to feel sleepy during the day especially at midday where most people take naps. You should get back to how you were sleeping before when you implement these steps. Good luck and we all here are wishing you the best. Hopefully we’ll hear your success story in a few weeks!

• This reply was modified 4 years, 10 months ago by Chee2308.

[Chee2308]

Hello David!
Resist the temptation to try any sleep effort because I found after trying them, the brain will want to monitor the result, whether it’s working etc. It is this active monitoring that keeps the mind active when you are trying to sleep and makes sleep difficult. When you’ve done nothing, there is nothing to monitor and the mind can shut off easier. With regards to your anxiety, realise it is normal. You are actively trying to escape it which is making it coming back more and more. Give up the struggle by not caring how sleep anymore. If not sleeping well makes you feel like crap the next morning, then expect it to happen and imagine having it already. Don’t shun it, allow yourself to be uncomfortable with the senario of sleeping badly. Over time, you’ll get used to it until you are not afraid of it anymore! You will have become accustomed to it and realise it can’t hurt you! You got through days when you slept badly the night before, many times, didn’t you? Well what makes it any different this time or in the future?? Not sleeping well can’t harm you and studies show insomnia have no long term effects on your health and wellbeing. There may be some short term discomfort but you’ll get through it like so many times before, so what’s the big deal? People with insomnia tends to spend lots of time in bed trying to sleep, sometimes 10-12 hours, almost half their lives, and even after all that, spend whatever amount of time awake, worrying and obessesing over sleep. Haven’t you realised how ridiculous this has become? Are you going to spend the rest of your life like that? Don’t you agree that is a horrible way to live, that you won’t even wish upon your worst enemy? Forget about the obessesion and forget about sleep for a while. Life is about enjoyment and fulfilment and it’s your birth right to enjoy life in this earth, not tormented by something you cannot actively control anyway. Did you think God sent you into this world so you can sleep half the time and therefore miss out on the other things that are fun and enjoyable?? Hell No! So you can tell your insomnia to go to he** and you will enjoy your life as you please from now on. Enough is enough and you will not put up with this nonsense anymore. Strengthen your circadian rthym and build your sleep drive naturally by going to bed after 18 hours awake and then slowly scaling that back in 15 minutes intervals to 17, 16 hours until you find your magic number. Good luck! We all here are wishing the best for you.

[Chee2308]

There’s nothing wrong with you. If you can sleep 3-4 hours, even just 1-2 hours means your sleep system is working perfectly fine. What you are describing is very typical for an insomniac. It’s your thoughts about sleep and the efforts you are doing that are making it worse. Do absolutely nothing except going to and getting out of bed the same time every day. Any endeavour you are doing to make sleep happen WILL fail because sleep just doesn’t respond to any type of effort, mental or physical. It is something that just happens naturally and your body produces sleepiness naturally, after being awake long enough. Sleep drive is a lot like hunger, both accumulate after not sleeping/eating long enough. Just go to bed after being awake for at least 18 hours continuously and if you find you fall asleep pretty fast, then start decreasing that to 17, 16 hours. Find the magic number that works for you because everyone is a bit different. Resist the temptation to try any sleep effort because after you done them, your mind will want to monitor the result, whether it’s working etc. It is this active monitoring inside your head that keeps you awake at night because your mind just can’t shut off. Stop all the monitoring and let your mind drift and wander as it wants, do not actively check whether you have fallen asleep, let it just happen naturally. You will find after sleeping better for few nights, you then tend to have diffficulty falling asleep again as fast as before. Expect this and accept this is normal because when you slept better, naturally your sleep drive is reduced and it then takes longer to drift off into sleep. But over time, your body will adjust so give it time and patience. Do these steps and your sleep should recover within a few weeks. Good luck!

[Chee2308]

Since you only just have insomnia, and as a former insomniac myself who has fully recovered, my advice to you are:
1. Immediately stop taking any form of medications for sleep. These never help and could make you get you addicted. Sleeping pills are extremely hazardous to you in the long term, both to your body and your sleep because they literally obliterate stage 3 sleep, making your sleep less restorative and you wake up feeling groggy which is worse than having never slept at all. Studies also show long term sleeping pills users have a higher chance of developing Alzheimer, dementia and a whole host of other problems. If you slept fine few days ago, then your sleep system is intact. Believe in yourself.
2. Don’t chase sleep by going to bed earlier. Actually the less you sleep, the longer you will sleep and the more restful that sleep is. Don’t go to bed based on what time it is but on how many hours you’ve spent awake. Most people generate 6-8 hours of sleep after being awake 16-18 hours. Since your insomnia is pretty recent, estimate the time you need to sleep based on your history and by fixing your get out of bed time, you get your bed time. Always get out of bed by that fixed time no matter how much you slept. Do not sleep in and do not compensate for lost sleep by napping or going to bed earlier.
3. Do not go down the rabbit hole of doing a ton of sleep efforts like supplements, modifying your daily routine specifically for sleep, or other useless stuffs. Sleep is natural and effortless. The less you do, the better. Even better, do nothing except fixing your bedtime and out of bed time!

Your sleep should recover after a few weeks, especially if you keep your sleep schedule religiously because sleep is essentially just a biological process that everyone goes through after being awake long enough. Don’t be alarmed if you can’t sleep. It just means you are taking longer to fall asleep after sleeping really well. Sleep drive is a lot like hunger, it builds from not sleeping/eating long enough. The longer you stay awake, the sleepier you should get assuming you don’t get anxious from not sleeping. Understand it is just a process and there’s nothing more to it.

Good luck and we all here look forward to hearing your success story!

[Chee2308]

Being not afraid of regressing is a sign you have truly recovered. Eventually you reach a stage where you don’t care anymore, you will have become much less attached to the outcome. By saying “I guess the worst thing is that I won’t sleep.”, this shows you are getting there! Life is meant to be enjoyed, in this case, going on a holiday. So you’ll do just that and not let insomnia control you. Imagine these kinds of possible senarios:
1. You don’t go on holiday and still sleep badly.
2. You don’t go on holiday but sleep well.
3. You go on holiday and sleep badly.
4. You go on holiday AND sleep well!

If you choose 1 or 2, you will ALWAYS lose something, i.e., the holiday OR the sleep OR in the worst case senario BOTH. If you choose 3 or 4, you will always gain something because you will have enjoyed your holiday and still have a good chance you sleep soundly. My point is you WILL always LOSE if you let insomnia control your life because there are no guarantees protecting your sleep will lead to sleeping well. Therefore always plan your life events with your personal enjoyment or gratification in mind, not sleep! I hope you choose 3 or 4 and do please enjoy yourself!

[Chee2308]

Hi Hhunter!
I can understand your situation and been through it on my recovery journey. What helped is being friends with wakefulness. There is no threat with being awake at night, you have simply conditioned your mind to perceive it as so. Read “The Sleep Book” by Dr Guy Meadows, in it he outlines a few methods on how to address sleep anxiety provoking thoughts. Basically, accept it and don’t fight it. When you no longer fear X, X has no control over you. Reward yourself by having something you really enjoy if you find yourself struggling to sleep. It may be ice-cream, chocolate or whatever. Show your mind it is okay to be awake. If you enjoy a challenge, even try daring your body to give you a difficult night! Show it you are not afraid because there is nothing to be afraid of, in all honesty. Be kind to yourself and practise self compassion. Imagine your kid telling you he’s afraid of monsters in the closet, what would you say to him because you know there’s nothing there! It is the exact same thing here, there’s nothing to be afraid of, it’s just sleep. In fact, studies have shown insomnia has no long term effects on your health or longevity. Enjoy your life the best you can and put sleep lower down the priority list. This tends to be a major problem with insomniacs. They try to spend lots of time in bed (sometimes 10-12 hours), basically almost half their lives being in bed and then even after all that, spend whatever hours being awake constantly worrying and obessesing about sleep. Have you realised how ridiculous this has become? Is that the way you want to live for the rest of your life? What a horrible way to live, you have let insomnia control you and your life. Tell yourself enough is enough! You will not put up with this nonsense any longer! You are a strong person, you must be because you are a parent and must have overcome even more difficult challenges. It is no different with this one. You can do this. Spend less time in bed, if sleep onset insomnia is an issue. Go to bed after being awake 18 hours continuously when your sleep drive is strong. Most people can fall asleep pretty fast after being up this long. Then when you’re comfortable, adjust that to 17, 16 hours. Find what works for you. Good luck!

[Chee2308]

Hello Random!
You may be easily roused if you go to bed with a weak sleep drive. I too was woken up several times by my snoring in the early mornings when my sleep tends to be lighter and also the couple of times when I took sleeping pills to sleep. Go to bed with a stronger sleep drive, i.e., after you have been awake longer. Find that magic number that puts you into a deeper sleep when you hit the sack. Most people sleep for 6 hours after being awake 18 hours. Try 16,17,18 hours and find what works for you because everyone is a bit different.

[Chee2308]

Your story really echoes a lot with mine but I did it in a lot less time, I got over my insomnia in just 3 months while you took years??? Most people don’t realise the journey to recovery is a lot less bumpy and much shorter as long as you develop the right mindset. Insomnia is really a mind issue so you really need to work on your thoughts and mindset if you want to find any relief. CBT-i works too but it is too academic and rigid to me and doesn’t address the mental aspect of insomnia, which is exactly what is causing and perpetuating sleep disruption for most people. Less attachment to the outcome and only going to bed when sleepy after staying awake long enough is all that it takes to sleeping normally again. Anything else including sleep medications are essentially useless and can even make it worse.

[Chee2308]

Hello Harvey!
Glad to hear you are continuing to improve. With regards to your wife, I can only say everyone is a bit different and that is why I encourage everyone to explore and experiment with their bedtimes to find what works for them. Some people might need 10 hours of sleep every night, apparently so with your wife, which is quite rare but most people get by with at least just 6. She must be a really good sleeper! In regards to your previous sleeping pattern, that’s called a biphasic sleeping pattern where you slept in 2 distinct phases. Nothing wrong with this sleeping pattern either, because if you try to calculate the actual amount of time spent sleeping (total time in bed minus time awake) before and now, it will be roughly the same, around 7 hours. You can’t shortchange your body with something as important as sleep because it knows and is keeping track of such things. You have simply conditioned your body to sleep that way by going to bed too early where sleep drive wasn’t as strong. What then resulted was a less restorative and fragmented sleep. Then when you awoke for 3 hours, you would have rebuilt that sleep drive again. Your body thinks you want it to sleep that way, because like I said, nature is flexible about sleep and your body may think you need to be awake at 12 – 3 am for some reason and that’s why it is behaving like that. By going to bed later after being awake longer, you are accumulating more sleep drive which then puts you into a deeper sleep, reconditions your body clock and strengthens your circadian rthym resulting in a new sleeping pattern. Going forward, I would encourage to keep your bedtimes as consistently as possible, within 30 minutes. If you need to stay up later for some reason, then keep your out of bed time the same if you want to stick to this sleep pattern. Do not sleep in and do not compensate for lost sleep, you might sleep less for one night but the effort will be worthwhile if you feel your current sleep pattern is worth keeping to.

Hello Nadya
I’m reading too many sleep efforts and all I can say they will ultimately fail because sleep doesn’t respond to any type of effort, physical or mental except being awake long enough. Try going to bed later, spend less time in bed and doing less! Yes, less is more when sleep is concerned. By doing more efforts targeted to get more sleep, the more elusive sleep becomes. That’s the paradox about sleep. People desperate for more sleep don’t get it. You get it when you don’t want it. Read “The Effortless Sleeping Method” by Sasha Stephens. Sleep is not something you need to do a ton of things to get. It is not like going into battle to fight an enemy or into an exam hall to pass an exam. If you continue the struggle with sleeplessness, the sleeplessness will persist! Do absolutely nothing and give up the struggle by not caring how you slept. Only then will great sleep start showing itself. Good luck!

[Author]

Posts