[gsdmom]

Hi Deb – about feeling better making dinner – it probably happened with an attitude change, accepting insomnia and feeling less stress as ACT seems to fit my personality more, and then having a bit more energy during the day because I’m conserving at night. Also less body aches. For so long my mind was so tired, I felt so awful knowing I couldn’t make a simple plan and execute it (dinner) without using all of my resources. A month or two ago, whenever I had a good day, I would spend it menu planning for the week and shopping so at least I had something in place, or catch up on cleaning and stuff.

By accepting insomnia I am also talking about it more, having it out in the open makes me feel less anxious. Then I find when I tell someone about it, they usually have their own story about it or they open up and talking about another troubling medical issue they are dealing with and then they probably leave the conversation feeling better also.

Steve – it does feel good to have stress levels down, but at this point, it still does not take much for stress to re-surface. I know its a long process. I hope your anxiety will decrease. Most nights I say a prayer that everyone here will have a steady recovery. The way I think about acceptance is that I am a person living with insomnia now but not forever, vs before I’d say I WAS insomnia living in this woman’s run-down body. I am trying to be hopeful knowing I can create physical changes in my body and brain and maybe even get some superficial treatment at a MedSpa with facial fillers to help with the undereye circles and drooping so I may look a little more refreshed.

[Pam1129]

Hey, I’ve now finished ‘The Sleep Book’ am falling asleep rather quickly , which hasn’t usually been my problem … I’m doing the best that I can on implementing the tools…
my goal is for a full 4-5 hours with ‘no wakes’ then maybe reach 6-7 hours!!!!
I want so badly to believe 100% that this is possible , and trying not to ‘try’ so hard at ‘making’ it happen … from Sasha’s book I have learned to STOP clock watching which I believe has been a huge help for me… however I wake up SO many times still… maybe I’m not accepting or welcoming very well??? Does it get easier with time,??? I do feel as tho I’m not laying there as long tossing
And turning( when I wake) and getting frustrated … but I would just love to NOT wake at all, and I feel ( and don’t want to admit it, the doubt I have) that it’s not ever going to happen ?!
Just hoping for some counsel/wisdom from you guys! It’s been great to read your posts!

[Steve]

Hi Pam. Welcome to this thread in the forum. How long have you been practicing ACT? Did you do CBT-i and SR/SC before that? Most of us who have been practicing ACT notice a quick reduction in the amount of anxiety that we have. But as for sleep, it does take awhile for the sleep itself to turn around. I have read that it takes some people two or more months to show improvement so don’t lose hope. Just keep practicing the tools both day and night and thinking positively and your sleep should get better. After awhile, the tools will come naturally to you and this will help you stay asleep. Also keep posting to this thread for support. We all help each other on here. Try not to get frustrated over your sleep as that will just prolong the insomnia. Learning to accept it for what it is will make your doubts start to go away. That’s when the healing will begin.

[Steve]

Suren – Did you get a chance to look over those links I sent you?

[Deb]

Hi Pam,

I don’t know if you read the post earlier about how people with insomnia have an overactive amygdala in the brain, which controls the fight or flight response. That’s why you wake up a lot. The brain is on constant alert, even when you’re asleep. So practicing ACT will help the brain start to settle down. That’s why it’s so important to practice acceptance and the other tools. Remember Carlos in the book who took two weeks to learn to lie peacefully in bed. You’re learning new skills and a new attitude towards sleep, so it will take some time to learn this. In Carlos’ case, his sleep didn’t improve within that two weeks but gradually it did after that. So don’t be in a hurry. Focus on learning the skills right now, not on the results.

I know how it is to have doubt and feel like it’s not going to work and just looking for some hope. That was me, every time I talked to the sleep doctor. I was desperate for some hope that this was really going to work. It did.

[suren]

Hi Steve, I haven’t been too active on the forum these last days as things have been a tad hectic at my work. So haven’t had a chance to go thru the latest set of posts. Hope I haven’t missed any other questions directed at me, but in answer to your question: Yes, I did have a chance to check out the links provided, so thanks again for sharing the resource. It largely cited the key differences between CBT and ACT, which I had gleaned prior from various sources (primarily the sleep book), but it was good to revisit this info again.

Hope everyone else is doing well!! And look forward to getting caught up on all that I’ve missed soon.

Suren

[Padron1926]

“I don’t know if you read the post earlier about how people with insomnia have an overactive amygdala in the brain, which controls the fight or flight response. That’s why you wake up a lot. The brain is on constant alert, even when you’re asleep.”

That’s not what the study showed at all. The amygdala has a lot of functions, not just fight or flight and wasn’t the conclusion of the study. Also they didn’t measure this while the people were sleeping, like you stated before.

[Deb]

This is the information shared with me by the sleep doctor, whose background is in sleep research. I didn’t personally look up any study. Also, in the Sleep Book, Dr. Guy says on page 39, “This is the primitive emotional brain center responsible for detecting the level of stress and fear in your environment. It releases the stress hormones cortisol and adrenaline, which help us prepare the body to stand and fight or run away in flight, otherwise known as the ‘fight-or-flight mechanism.” I didn’t feel the need to verify this either. It made sense to me because it seemed that something is going on in the brain beyond our conscious control that wakes us up or gives us light sleep. We don’t choose for this to happen.

[Borgesbi]

Padron 1926,

With all due respect, I find it unnecessary and unhelpful to write a post to try to point out something someone said that might not sound accurate to you. The vibe on this thread is of help and support as you may have noticed and not to try to call out on what we are saying that may or not be supported by a study – unless someone was going completely overboard and not being helpful. We are all on difficult journeys and sharing anything that may be helpful to us, being to just vent or offer support. Even if it’s a theory from the sleep doctor or from Deb herself (which I know is not the case), it’s alright, and honestly, by Deb sharing this info it helped me accept my awakenings more and feel more relaxed about them. Understanding the biological reasonings behind my insomnia help me a lot, even if it’s just a theory. Anyway, hope you can get/offer some support here too. All the best!

[burn]

I want to support what Borgesbi said with my own observations.

Couple weeks ago, when I fully committed to ACT, I had a night in which I couldn’t fall asleep for half of the night. I was lying there peacefully, and gently analyzing myself. I realized that I was not stressed, I was calm, my mind was not racing and yet I was awake. I compared my feelings to one of the prior night, when I fell asleep easy and I realized I felt myself about the same on both good and not so good night, yet couldn’t fall asleep on that not so good night. It is that night that helped me to realize there is nothing I am doing wrong at any particular night that distinguished bad night from good night. It is just state of a brain (maybe too much activation during the day) which I can not control right away. I fully realized back then the “biologiness” of the process – there are some changes in my brain, with which nothing I can do right away and they will require time to get back to normal. Whatever those changes are, it is through continuous pacification and nurturing that I can eventually bring my brain back to normal. Whatever I inactive or activate in my brain through mindfulness tools, it helps. My sleep is getting better.

[Deb]

Padron – It’s been a long time since we heard from you. How are you doing? Are you getting better, or recovered? For myself, understanding that my light sleep was perfectly normal due to an active brain and that there wasn’t much I could do about it because it was happening on an unconscious level, was huge. Then I could accept it, relax and I recovered from insomnia in less than two weeks. I’m going on 3 weeks of recovery now.

[Steve]

I have to agree with you Burn. There is something biological in all of this. Last night was a really bad night for me since I started ACT and I really don’t know why. I went out with some friends and when I got home, I had to kind of rush around to do things to get ready for bed. As it was, I was probably 15 minutes late getting into bed from my normal time and I really didn’t have my usual wind-down period. Maybe that’s why. Anyway, it took me awhile to fall asleep and then I only slept for two hours. I was able to refrain from tossing and turning by using the tools but for some reason, the bad thoughts kept coming back even after I made peace with them initially. So, after about 3 hours of lying there, I started to address my insomnia directly and “get to know it” rather than just lying there and letting my mind wander. That seemed to work and I got two half hours of sleep between 3 and 4. But then I was awake again. It has to be something biological with this and I just need to overcome it. I will say this. Being able to stay in bed with ACT has given me more energy. If I was still doing SC, I would be dead tired today after last night. I just hope that I don’t start stressing about going to bed again like I did months ago. That just led to the worse insomnia.

[Deb]

I think you’ll be fine, Steve, if you just try to relax and keep going. Your bad night was probably caused by the worry about not having your usual wind down time and going to bed a little late. Accept that all that you do is for the good, like going out with friends! Don’t worry if you’re not doing things perfectly, because ACT is all about learning to relax and not following strict rules. Even with the sleep window, Dr. Guy recommends some flexibility of plus or minus a half hour.

But I know that this is easier said than done. Glad the tools worked for you in the middle of the night and you could get a couple more hours of sleep after using them and you have some energy today.

[burn]

Steve,

You always record a very detailed log of sleep. Just today I found news that, “sleep tracking apps contribute to insomnia”. You can Google the news by this title, it’s on University of Washington when site. They suspect that being obsessed with sleep quality feeds more insomnia.

I stopped logging my sleep about 10 days ago, and I think it helps. Not all nights were perfect, on some nights I slept through the night. After some nights I was waking up quite refreshed and energized and first memory after a night was that I fell asleep fast and wasn’t waking up during the night. Upon further thinking I started recalling that no, I didn’t fall asleep right away, it took a while, and I had some wakenings during the night. But hey, I felt quite good in the morning, so should I really analyze my sleep and thinking that it is still not perfect or just proceed with my day happy and pretty energized? I stopped logging sleep, and I think it helps me.

I bought another book on mindfulness for insomnia and they highlight that key to restoring sleep is “willingness to lose control over your sleep”. As part of losing control I dropped sleep log. If I feel ok in the morning, than it’s great, even in the night wasn’t perfect. If I don’t feel ok, then there is no need to feed the insomnia monster even further by fretting, overthinking and overanalyzing last night sleep.

Maybe your should stop sleep log, at least for a while as a mini experiment?

[Steve]

Burn – Actually, I Don’t keep a sleep diary anymore. I just write it in from memory as to what happened last night. I stopped with the sleep diary because I agree it was stressful. It was also notable in that it was the first really bad night since I started ACT.

Debt – Thanks for the support. I know from Martin’s course that you can never predict what will happen for that night’s sleep. I look forward to see what happens tonight.

[Author]

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