[Mac0908]

Yeah I am not really disagreeing and was surprised how against it she was in her book when it’s well documented and well known that SRT can help many people with sleep problems.

I could understand her being against doing SRT at the first sign of insomnia but to be pretty much against it and to call it a crutch isn’t really right and didn’t sit well with me after reading that particular chapter in her book.

[Deb]

Also, Sasha was contacted by people complaining about SR who had sleep windows of only 4 or 5 hours, which is way too little sleep. I think that turned her against it too.

I think for me, it definitely helped to kick start things. In my first week I slept 5 out of 7 nights which was so much better than before I started.

[Daf]

Folks, if you haven’t already, you might find this post, which I started and Martin has added some useful comments on,  of some interest…

ACT Different from SRT?

 

[Deb]

Thanks, Daf. I’ll check it out.

[Mac0908]

My previous 8 nights:

Thursday night 1/24 – good sleep. Felt good on Friday.

Friday night 1/25 – bad night. Felt tired on Saturday, but not zombie like.

Saturday night 1/26 – GREAT. Felt like a million bucks on Sunday.

Sunday night 1/27 – decent. Still tired on Monday but nothing horrible.

Monday night 1/28 – Bad night. Felt tired Tuesday, but not zombie like.

Tuesday night 1/29 – Good. Felt good on Wednesday.

Wednesday night 1/30 – After what has been a solid previous week, my sleep anxiety is at it’s lowest point in months. I go to bed and have a GREAT 7 hours of sleep. felt like a million bucks on Thursday.

And well, here I am again. Back here. Because then last night, Thursday night, it happened. A flat out really bad night. It wasn’t just cockiness. I truly felt like I was healing. I truly felt like this was a serious turn in my journey of getting better. So for starters, I kept my laptop open until 9:30pm. I had been on it for hours previously. Then, I had that sick thought in my head that’s happened many times over the last 2+ years. Since I had a decent little run in the previous week or so of feeling like I was getting better, I thought tonight MIGHT just “have to be” a bad night. Because this good run can’t go on forever, right? This is the mind of a chronic insomniac. This is the summary of my life the last 2+ years. A sick mind. Next thing I knew I wasn’t all that tired around what was my normal bedtime of 10:30ish in the previous 8 days. I didn’t go to bed until 11:15pm, and didn’t end up crashing for another half hour or so until 11:45pm. This would be the latest I’d end up asleep in over a week. I then woke at 5:15am. 5 ½ of sleep for someone who I’ve mentioned before cannot function with anything under 6. Today, Friday, I am a zombie. My eyes bloodshot. Dark circles brutal. My first zombie day in well over a week yeah, but still a setback, and a setback I didn’t really feel coming.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by Mac0908.
• This reply was modified 5 years, 9 months ago by Mac0908.

[Daf]

Five and a half hours…. I’ll swap ya!

Guess its all relative (as we have said before) and needs dependent….. (I see some folks here go for three days with nil sleep. Amazing how different folks’s needs are, I guess

[Deb]

I’ve had a setback too, Mac. This whole week has been a setback, although I’m trying to make sense of it. My week, according to the sleep diary that I fill out for Martin, starts on Saturday. Both Saturday and Sunday were bad, although at least I have an explanation for them. I tried to do the Guy Meadows thing of staying in bed in being mindful, hoping I would fall asleep. Well that was a total washout since I didn’t know what I was doing. Saturday night I lay there until 2:00 and Sunday night till 3:00 and then finally, totally disgusted, got up. Decided I better go back to SC.

Had two good nights after that, and now have had two bad nights. Wednesday slept 4 hours and last night maybe 4.5. I’m totally wiped out today. My interpretation of these nights is as follows: I’m finally having to deal with the fears. Somehow I was able to avoid them for the most part the last 4 weeks with my run of 5 good nights each week. But now I’ve got to learn how to deal with them, so that’s why they are showing up now.

Does this make any sense? Anyway, this is how I’m making sense of them. If I don’t make sense of this I’ll lose my hope and my sanity. And we gotta keep hope some how. So now I’m trying to accept the fact that I may have some bad nights ahead of me for awhile. Then maybe an upswing will start again.

I’m sorry you had a bad night, Mac, but I’m glad you had several pretty good nights before that. So you do seem to be doing better. And I see that you’re able to make sense of the bad night. So things can gradually continue to get better for you along with the acceptance of the ups and downs along the way.

[Mac0908]

Deb you sound like you’ve been all over the place. I think its best you just continue with SRT and stick with it. Shorten your window again if you need to, and of course, the obvious, don’t enter that bedroom until you’re completely exhausted to the point where the exhaustion can outweigh most of the anxiety.

One other thing about me and my very bad night last night. It is interesting to note that from 10-11pm before I soon went to bed, I was watching a very entertaining, somewhat exciting/dramatic show. Normally when 10pm hits, I am winding down with something completely boring on the tube. I don’t think there is any irony that this was the first night in over a week that I was up past 10:30 watching TV feeling wide awake. It was the show that kept me up. I even sensed it a bit as I watched. Add on my constant laptop use for hours that went way later than usual, and its just another factor IMO.

This is why we as recovering insomniacs need to be very careful. Our nervous systems are still VERY fragile. This doesn’t go away after a day, a week or maybe even a month of better sleep. It’s difficult but also crucial IMO to stay the course until absolute certain you are 100% healed. Even with my decent past 8 days and nice few previous nights, I knew full well last night that I was still fragile. After 2+ years, I can honestly say (and feel) it will probably take me at least 2+ MONTHS of nonstop good sleep to be completely cured. Meanwhile I haven’t put together more than 3 good nights since my beginning of SRT.

Time  to get back to reality. Have a good weekend everyone.

[Daf]

Good points Mac,

I don’t think it ever really goes away. Two months, two years, whatever.

Indeed, accepting it as part of your life is very good therapy – and linked to mindfulness, very much.

Like you, I have had it over 2 years.

I went 7 glorious straight weeks in late summer and 6 straight weeks earlier in 2018 with no nil-sleep night at all. But it came back… there was no trigger BTW! Both times I would regularly say, “I’ve cracked it, it’s gone for good.”  I will never say that again.

So, accepting it is part of living with it.

If you keep practising SRT (though not slavishly), keep good sleep hygiene practices but always remember that if and when it comes back, to then just accept it, say “Sure I did not sleep last night, so what!” and not fight or stress over it, it will be OK.

[Deb]

Last night was another bad night with only 3.5 hours of sleep. But had an important realization. This was my third bad night in a row with the first night of 4 hours of sleep and the second night with 3.5 hours. I was so exhausted last night after two bad nights that I turned off the alarm after getting up again at 3:30. I couldn’t bear the thought of only 2.5 hours if I finally fell asleep at 4:00 and had to get up at 6:30. But then I realized that if kept my sleep window completely open I might keep getting up all night and never sleep at all. I realized that something psychological about knowing I had to get up at a certain time helped me to fall asleep even if only for a few hours. So since I’ve been doing this program with a set time to get up I haven’t had all nighters like I used to. I did give myself one extra hour and set the alarm for 7:30. Amazingly I’m not a total zombie today. Somehow I got lucky (or God blesse me – my interpretation) with good sleep in those few hours.

Anyway my point is that having a consistent sleep window really helps.

[Kathryn Stewart]

Have had insomnia past 13 years. Was diagnosed bipolar in 2008. Have been on Seroquel since 2012. Pre-diabetic due to Seroquel. Tapering off Seroquel w/many problems. Tapered off too quickly in December only to find myself returning to MAXIMUM dose of 200mg. Once again, tapering down slowly—lowering 25mg every 4th night.

have started Accupuncture twice/week.

A crazy little tip I’ve had luck with: when I lay my head down on pillow and find I cannot fall asleep I will hold one eye open and stare at the wall. Every time I have tried this exercise my body has succomed to sleep b/c the sheer effort of holding that eye open is tiring.

Kat Stew

 

 

[Deb]

Sounds like worth a try

[Mira]

Hey Daf, Zopiclone gives me a night of 7 hours and it’s  amazing. But I only took it once as I read a lot of negative stuff about it on the internet. I feel like this forum helps me not to dispair and that I’m not alone. Thank you guys for that!

[Deb]

Have had three nights in a row of a full night of sleep. This morning wasn’t even tempted to lay in bed awhile longer after the alarm went off because I was so rested. This program works! I think I took a dip last week but now I’m back on track.

[Mac0908]

Wonderful to hear Deb, but lets not get c0cky of course, right? When you say this program works, can you explain exactly what you’ve been doing lately?

I had good nights Friday, Saturday AND Sunday. Last night, not so much. Though not a horrible night, I’m definitely tired today. Got about 6 hours I’d say. I’ll tell you as brutal as insomnia in general is, having a bad night after several good nights thinking you may just be healed has to be one of the worst feelings in all of this. Such a tease to go from 3-4 days of feeling well rested and good to feeling like a zombie again. I haven’t had a full week of good sleep in almost 2.5 years now, but I’m more optimistic than ever before, and I’ve been sleeping better than I ever have in a long time, so, here’s to staying the course and staying confident.

[Author]

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