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Hi Paulk, I’m sorry you are going through such a tough time.
But even though you are tired, you have really hit the nail on the head: “my biggest issue is sleep worry”
I am guessing that your mind is racing a lot, so it is really hard to focus. But maybe you can find a comfortable chair and just sit for a while. And maybe just “watch your mind”–by that I mean just noticing that wow, my mind is zipping around like crazy, and that I’m having this thought that I am really worried about sleep. Not trying to stop the thoughts or solve anything.
I know this can sound simplistic, maybe even downright stupid. But if you can sit and watch your thoughts drift (or race) on by instead of jumping in the raging river with them, it could help. Actually, I know it will help because I went through a similar mess for quite a while.
Hard to be patient or even sit still, when everything is so instant these days. But the sleep will come on its own. Easier said than done, but still true.
Hi dbaldino, I wish I had an easy solution. All I can do is relay my own experiences with sleep meds. Take away anything you find useful.
Over the years I probably went through 20 different sleep meds. Some worked for a while–a few months, but most of the time it was a matter of weeks or even days. And also times when nothing worked. Pharmacists know more about the effect of meds than the prescribing docs, and they have told me that it is natural to build up a tolerance, sometimes fairly soon, unfortunately. There simply is no pill which you can count on to sleep well on a consistent basis.
Re the specifics of clonazepam’s half-life and a safe tapering schedule, I would consult a pharmacist.
I understand desperation for sleep, believe me. But check out Martin’s emails and comments on this forum. He wrote recently about confronting anxiety, that it is part of our makeup, and trying to get rid of it is like getting rid of your heartbeat. I won’t try to elaborate further because I don’t want to mischaracterize his comments, but do check it out.
Example: actually, I did not sleep well myself last night. And just now a thought went through my head about my to-do list today, how am I going to do it all, what if I don’t sleep well tonight? And I am trying to approach all this as follows:
Instead of …..”what if I don’t sleep well tonight, or the next night, I can’t handle this anymore” and instead of trying to force these thoughts out of my head, I am going with ….”I’m having the thought that maybe I won’t sleep well tonight, or the next night, and that I can’t handle this anymore.” That is, prefacing whatever thought barreling through my head with “I’m having the thought that….” And I know very well this sounds simplistic and it is easy to slip into cynicism and darkness, especially when you are hammered from insomnia. But I hope you can slow down and give it a try.
Take care, you are not alone.
HI judi, regarding mindfulness, it can sound simplistic or trendy. You may have to check a number of sources to see what resonates for you. Suggest don’t write it off if the first few you check out sound flaky or weird.
A couple of free sites are palousemindfulness.com and mindfulnessnorthwest.com The first is free, period. The latter does offer seminars for fees, but also lots of free material, and there is no pressure to buy. Neither site is cluttered with ads or any interruptions.
Basically mindfulness pertains to really dialing in to the present moment, even if it seems mundane. It can feel somewhat awkward or slow at first, if you are used to lots of stimulation, which I think is sort of the status quo in our culture right now.
I would not approach it as a surefire cure for insomnia. There isn’t one. Sleep is rather simply something which naturally occurs, if only we can get out of the way and let it happen. Mindfulness can help because it involves stepping back and observing rather than being constantly caught up in the stimulus swirl.
Finally, you can spend lots of time talking about mindfulness, or reading or watching videos about it, when actually what really works is doing it. And don’t be concerned when your mind wanders –palousemindfulness.com addresses this issue particularly well.
Hey, nothing to lose, right?
And even if you are tired and things aren’t as good as you would like at the moment, I hope you can have a Happy Thanksgiving.
Hi judi, yes, it is tough summoning the energy to work when you are super tired. I don’t have a magic answer. I will describe what I did and maybe you will find something here to help.
Getting through law school in my late 20s, then law practice in offices through my 30s and early 40s, it amounted to caffeine, will power and the intense nature of the work I was doing. It helped when I mostly gave up the idea I had to sleep well. And there were a variety of sleep meds which would work temporarily. In my 40s and 50s I was working for myself in a scaled-down practice, not much money in it but a flexible schedule which sometimes meant taking naps. In my late 50s as my energy level naturally started to subside, I got less able to deal with the emotional aspects and left law practice altogether to work all sorts of jobs, e.g. delivering mail and working as a courier for the blood bank. And I was lucky that my wife had a good-paying job, though I will would have made it if I had stayed single.
Over the years I finally discovered mindfulness. I don’t mean the fad that is going around, but rather the whole concept of cognitive behavioral therapy, which incidentally is what Martin’s course is all about. Over time, I learned to stop trying to think my way out of insomnia or any other problems, instead watching my thoughts drift through my mind (or race through my mind, though that is harder until you remember to let things slow down).
Prayer was also part of the solution. I am not talking about some miracle fantasy, but rather prayer for the strength to get through this moment, this nanosecond. The next moment might be tough, too, but it’s in the future, deal with it when it’s here. And it turns out not every moment is awful.
In short, I had to scale back to do the best I could, and try not to let insomnia become this all-powerful ogre. Tough to do when you are really hammered, but try to be gentle with yourself. And know you are not alone in this. Take care.
——————————(Please don’t think this means you will struggle with insomnia for years. I had lots of childhood trauma to work through, so it took longer. And I went through lots of doctors who didn’t want to explore insomnia all that much, just write a prescription for different meds.)
Hi Jenna, and I am glad you found Martin’s site.
There are millions of people walking around who did not sleep that well the night before. And sometimes the reasons are due to what’s happening right now–pain from a sore knee, anxious about sleeping through an early alarm clock, noisy neighbors, overdue bills, etc. I imagine there could be nights of poor sleep due to pregnancy, etc. In other words, what’s called situational insomnia. It happens.
The bigger problem is when insomnia starts taking on a life of its own. The initial reason for the poor sleep has passed, but you spent a lot of days tired with your brain getting scrambled with thoughts along the lines of “I can’t handle this,” “I’m probably not going to sleep well tonight, who knows when, how much longer am I supposed to live like this,” etc.
When I find myself falling back into this rut–and setbacks happen–I try to remind myself not to take my thoughts too seriously, that I’m pretty hammered from insomnia right now and not thinking straight, that the thoughts are just popping into my head unannounced and sometimes even bizarre, but I can just let them drift through my mind like cloud shapes passing through the sky.
And that nobody sleeps great every night….I wish I had slept better last night, but hey, I’ve been here before. In other words, not freaking out about sleep when it is something which will just come on its own when I stop trying.
Take care, you are indeed not alone in this.
Hi SleepyKel, I think you are off to a good start—not that it’s an automatic progression to improved sleep every night—but not gauging your progress by a clock makes sense. Ditto the podcast. And you are already onto not trying to force sleep.
I am a man, so I cannot speak to post-menopause. I can say that my wife is at that stage in life, and she sleeps well, i.e. post-menopause is not an automatic impediment to sleep.
This is not to minimize what you’re going through, and even when you sleep well fairly regularly, no doubt there will be nights when it’s not so good. I can say that no matter the reason, it does not have to mean you are sliding back into the abyss or whatever. I think if we can accept that okay, I didn’t sleep too well last night or even the last few nights, I’m pretty hammered right now, it can lead to better sleep if we can avoid freaking out and just let sleep happen.
Easier said than done, and hard to think straight when tired, I know. Anyway, I think you are on the right track.
Hi reforger, your request for advice “that works” is straightforward and sounds quite reasonable. The tricky part is that insomnia is not the type of problem you can solve logically, like say, wiring a house. There are certain rules about how electricity works, e.g. how many volts a device can transmit. If you follow the rules, you can build an electrical system and get the lights to turn on and off. (Or if you’re like me, get someone who knows what they’re doing rather than electrocute yourself or burn down the house—so maybe not the best analogy!)
My point is that insomnia does not make sense. The way it is supposed to work, when you are tired, you simply fall asleep, like babies do. What happens is we get something on our minds, don’t fall asleep right away, then start worrying about not sleeping. Once this happens, the thing we worried about initially can disappear, doesn’t matter, because now we can’t sleep because we are worried about not sleeping. And then we try not to think about that, which means you just think about it all the more. And on and on. And then you are exhausted from not sleeping, you can’t think straight, and who knows what kind of thoughts pop into your head, e.g. I wish I would just die, if only I could sleep, no one understands what I’m going through, etc etc.
What I found most helpful was any type of mindful awareness, which is a fad right now but has been around for centuries. There are free sites, e.g. palousemindfulness.com which you can explore to find something which resonates for you. The key is simply being aware of your thoughts, not being dominated by them. And I realize this sounds simplistic, but I travelled the insomnia road for a long time (doesn’t mean you will–lots of childhood trauma to work through) and while there is no guarantee of perfect sleep all the time, it is a solid way forward.
The other big benefit I discovered was praying for the strength to get through this nanosecond. Not prayer for a permanent cure, just for this nanosecond. Five minutes from now is the future; you don’t need help to get through that because it is not here. I live in a secular part of the U.S. where many people don’t believe in prayer or God, or at least in a God who loves us, but I offer this for your consideration.
And finally, I suggest sticking with this site. Even if you cannot afford the formal course, Martin offers a lot of free resources like emails and podcasts. It can be helpful to get reminders to stay on track, and also to know you are not alone.
Take care.
Hi Icymeringue, it sounds like you are really up against it right now. I am guessing that you know intellectually that worrying about how well you are going to sleep tonight is almost a guarantee that you will not sleep well. Or maybe you will somehow sleep okay tonight—but there’s the next night to worry about, then the next night…..
And trying to shove those worrisome thoughts to the side just gives them more energy.
So what to do? For what it’s worth, when I get into a rough patch of poor sleep, I try to think along these lines: “Okay, I’m tired. And I am having thoughts about oh no, how am I going to make it today. And since I am pretty hammered from lack of sleep, my thoughts are scattered all over the place. But maybe I can slow down and realize that I am freaked out about this. And that sure, I would like to sleep better tonight, but maybe I can let go of desperation a little bit.”
In other words, just acknowledging unpleasant thoughts and letting them drift by can be an alternative to trying to think them away, and also an alternative to giving them power. They’re just thoughts, not indisputable precepts set in stone.
There is a huge difference between:
1. “I’m having the thought that I wish I would die, life is hopeless because I can’t sleep”; and
2. “I wish I would die, life is hopeless because I can’t sleep.”
It is hard to see the difference when you’re hammered from insomnia. But it’s there, and it’s really big.
Take care, you are not alone in this.
Hi Nav, I don’t know how long ago you lost your mum, but I do know there is no set timeline for recovery. Anyway, it sounds like insomnia moved in and has decided to keep hanging around.
Sleep meds can help short term, but if there was a med out there which cured insomnia for good, you would have heard about it. Doctors will prescribe something because they can, and many are not really into listening to what’s going in your life that might be driving the insomnia. Good at fixing tangible, specific things–medical engineers; beyond that, not a real solid bet for a cure. (If the sleep study shows you have sleep apnea, the docs are good at resolving that. CPAPs are kind of a hassle, but you can get used to them and they do work.)
I know it sounds simplistic to just let sleep happen, though I will have to give that a try myself at bedtime tonight. I had a stressful event yesterday, and so it is not a big surprise I did not sleep that well last night. So okay, I’m tired. And the stress isn’t totally gone, so who knows, maybe I won’t sleep that well tonight, either. Sure, I would rather get a good sleep tonight, but if it doesn’t happen, I’ll be okay, I have been here before.
And here comes the thought that omg, what if the insomnia is coming back long term, how will I live, I don’t want to go through that anymore, I would rather die, no one understands, why can’t I sleep, what’s wrong with me, I can’t handle this etc etc. Okay, this thought is passing through, but rather than buy into it and live it for hours, I am going to just let it drift on through my head like a cloud passing by in the sky until it’s out of view.
Suggest you sign up for Martin’s updates (emails/podcasts) for tips—-and also a reminder that you are not alone in this. People who have never had sleep problems can’t relate, but we can!
Hi, kho4874, it sounds like you are really going through the grinder right now.
It is so hard to think straight when exhausted, and I totally get the idea of losing hope. All I can say is I try to focus on the present moment and maybe even find something good in it, even if there is pain, too. As in okay, I did not sleep well last night, but I am sitting in a warm house and this coffee really tastes good. Without focusing on a to-do list, or how am I going to get through the day, much less my life, etc. And when the coffee is gone and it’s time to get up, what does the next moment bring.
And maybe hope becomes not much solving a problem, but a sense of coping with what’s going on right now, again maybe even finding something enjoyable. I find when I can do this—and I know it’s easy to fall off the rails for a while–that my panic starts to fade away. And I can even start to give myself credit for resilience–like what you have, still battling to stay on the job.
Unfortunately it can take a while to make progress, and it’s not like a steady improvement every day until you achieve perfection. So it can be hard to be patient.
I get the feeling that you are more resilient than you are giving yourself credit for. And I am hoping you can trust that can get through this moment, even if it is a tough one.
I always think it sounds so simplistic when people say, ” just relax, let sleep just happen” when they haven’t been through the hell of insomnia. But it does come down to letting go, and it isn’t really hell because it doesn’t last forever, even though it can seem that way.
Take care, you are not alone in this.
Hi Jen72, I am hoping you can locate a medical professional you can trust and talk to. Someone who will listen as you describe the anger in more detail, and who also can give a full exam to put your mind at ease about toxic chemicals. I think it is unlikely that you have sustained any sort of permanent damage, but let someone check you out. I am certainly glad that you did not puncture the can near an open flame, if I am reading this correctly.
Not sleeping can lead us to think all sorts of stuff and sometimes even act on those thoughts. Please know you are not alone when it comes to feeling really scrambled by insomnia.
Hi Erica, I can relate to your frustration and your wanting to solve the problem with a technique. The last thing I wanted to hear was “oh, don’t worry, just relax,” because it sounded so simplistic—especially coming from someone who sleeps fine. They just don’t understand what it’s like, right?
I dealt with insomnia for many years (doesn’t mean you will, there was lots of trauma to deal with, etc etc.). My point is only that I have been there. And it is only natural to want to find a method, a technique, to solve it. At least it seems that way where I am, in the USA where a lot of Americans have a “can do” attitude in their DNA–a good thing when it comes to planning a building project, or how to finance a mortgage, even dealing with specific, definable health problems where you fix something, like setting a broken leg.
Lots of doctors are more like medical engineers–good at specific, definable but in the emotional realm, not so helpful and sometimes downright unhelpful. Many will prescribe sleep meds, which can work short term, until you build up a tolerance. And then you can move on to the next drug, which might work for a while, or maybe not.
Unfortunately it does not work so well when ….I don’t know, a natural process is involved. Sleeping is like breathing. You don’t plan and then employ a technique for breathing. The body breathes itself just fine (unless you have a specific, medical problem to address, such as oxygen deficiency). “Sleep just happens” sounds simplistic, but you might have noticed times when you weren’t trying to sleep and yet you find yourself dozing off.
Everyone has their own journey, but for me, what worked best was mindfulness meditation, where I learned to live in the moment—and also prayer, for the strength to get through the moment, if it was a really bad one.
One thing I know for sure: you are not condemned to a lifetime of insomnia, even though it can feel that way when you are too tired to think straight.
Hi Inga, sorry to hear it has been a rough time this year for you.
I am not a long Covid researcher, and I have to think even they would concede there is much still to learn about it. But fortunately the brain fog is starting to diminish for you.
I can speak to insomnia, and I know that a stressful event (e.g. getting Covid, especially long Covid) can trigger insomnia, which can hang around long after the stressful event has subsided. It can take on a life of its own. How does this happen?
For me, I found that the more I thought about it, the more entrenched it became. This would lead to another thought, along the lines of: “Great, so I am supposed to just not think about it?” and I would resent people’s simplistic, “positive,” i.e. relentlessly upbeat false cheer.
What I found over time was that thoughts just pop into our heads wherever, whenever, pretty much out of nowhere. And I eventually learned to just watch them come and go, sometimes saying to myself, “I am having some pretty lousy thoughts right now,” and simply acknowledging that “I haven’t slept well for quite a while and I am really tired.” This might sound like wallowing in misery, but what I’m trying to get at it is just observing what’s happening. And if you can let the thoughts drift, I think you will find that they do not last indefinitely, unless you decide to hold onto them.
I wanted to solve insomnia, the way you try to figure out how to assemble a piece of furniture or whatever. You can’t just let go and the piece of furniture will assemble itself, but letting go of anxiety about insomnia is the answer.
But this gets right back to sounding simplistic: how in the hell are you supposed to “let go”—- but this is getting back into the mode of trying to think your way to a solution.
Mindfulness is sort of a fad right now, but if you can sweep aside the hype, at least I found there is a reason it has been around for 3,000 years. It can take some searching to find something that resonates for you, but you might want to check out the likes of mindfulness northwest.com or palousemindfulness.com
And try to give yourself a break. It is really hard to think straight when you’re exhausted, and like I say, if you can just observe your thoughts drifting by like branches or leaves on a stream…
Take care, you are not alone in this.
Hello, fellow lifelong insomniac. I am 71, and started having trouble sleeping when I was 27. Lots of reasons, lots of issues to work through…..
For me, the biggest help getting the strength to get through the next moment has been prayer. And the biggest help for addressing the insomnia itself has been CBT. I haven’t taken Martin’s course, but it looks similar to techniques I used before I found this website. And I can tell you emphatically that you aren’t too old to do it.
What I discovered is how much our thoughts can run the show, and how much weight we can give them, when actually they are just any thoughts which happen to pop into our heads. For example, it sounds like you are feeling like you are too old to heal. I am not discounting your feeling this way; no doubt it is a strong feeling. But consider whether we tend to see feelings as the be-all and end-all: if this is the way I feel, it must be the way things are.
Instead, how about this: that feeling that “I am too old to heal” is not the same as an objective fact, such as gravity. If you drop something, it will fall to the ground, regardless how you feel about it.
“I’m having the thought that I am too old to heal” is vastly different from “I am too old to heal.” That you feel you are too old does not make it so, even though you feel strongly. And “I am too old to heal” does not rank up there with gravity as an objective fact.
Sorry if this sounds esoteric or whatever, again, I’m 71, and I got better. One last thing—and when I don’t sleep well now and then I have to try to remind myself—it is hard to think straight when you are really hammered from insomnia. For me, that’s when feelings seem all-powerful, where they must be true (even though they’re not).
Take care, and I hope you stick with this website and program.
Hi GaryK, wow, it sounds like you are really going through the mill right now.
If you are not testing positive for Covid, I would hazard a guess that you may feel that you’re having a reaction to the vaccine you got last year. I haven’t heard of any side effects persisting that long—however, this is not to minimize at all your feeling that it might be a factor.
I found that when I was hammered from insomnia, that I would think and feel all sorts of things. This can happen even when rested, but I found that exhaustion could really mess with my head. I can totally relate to seriously considering suicide. I think it is a good sign that you are upfront about it. I hope only that you keep trying to get help, even though it sounds like it has been really frustrating. It might help just to acknowledge that you are going through it, you are really tired, but you know what, I’m just going to do the best I can.
If only there was a medication that would guarantee good, consistent sleep. I tried a couple dozen or so. If there were, there would be people lined up for miles/km. And as for an operating room type drug, unfortunately that is not the answer either. I think that led to Michael Jackson’s demise.
I hope you stick with this website. Martin has a lot of material which covers how we react to insomnia, sometimes giving it power over our lives. This is not to deny that insomnia is really tough to deal with. But for what it’s worth, I found that I did somewhat better when I could just say to myself, “OK, I’m tired.” And then, just dealing with the next moment. Not the next five minutes, the next nanosecond.
And when I sometimes thought I could not handle it anymore, I eventually learned there is a huge difference between:
1. I cannot handle this anymore, I am going to kill myself; and
2. I’m having the thought that I can’t handle this anymore. I’m having the thought I am going to kill myself.
Take care, you are definitely not alone in this.
