[spunkyspangler]

forgot to mention about what u said about the performance pressure, i think just look at it as a record of past successes and positive reflection on every thing. just simply a record of what has happened in the past, and not looked at as u have to perform that in the present or future, simply a record nothing more nothing less

hope that helps

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

just my opinion from what i have heard from martin and other CBTI practioners, i am not saying give yourself a “rating”, what i am saying is that by putting pen to paper in a positive way of seeing things as i mentioned about, i can see it doing any harm. they say people who put pen to paper average a 42% higher successs rate in achieving their goals !

u mentioned about good sleepers what they do and u are right they do absolutely NOTHING !!

before my trigger went off a few months back i was a great sleeper, could drink double expressors of coffee while eating a pizza and have no problems going to sleep etc

what i thing the difference is now for me anyway is that this trigger went off and i responded to it in a negative way which fueled the condition. as martin has sent out in his free course we are completing sleep diaries, when we go to bed, how much time to fall asleep how much time awake how much sleep window when we start our day yada yada.

i think by keeping track of that one can see on paper the progress being made, i think that people tend to only focus on the negative of a bad night and think that the good nights were a fluke or what have u

perhaps martin or scott can give feedback on this as i am new to it so dont take what i say as gospel.

cheers

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

thanks for your feedback much appreciated, yes it does make things difficult when u start your day at 3 am LOL
i try to think along the line of i am really going to build up my sleepdrive for the coming night etc. after a few days of that i then sleep to the alarm and i am thinking it is because of the lack of prolonged sleep and the drive just overpowers the early moring wake up etc

i shall keep on keeping on

thanks

daniel

[spunkyspangler]

i think it would be a great idea to keep a sleep time journal, and write down all the positive nights. something about putting pen to paper strengths the belief system so i understand

even when u dont get a great sleep, u can always frame it in a positive way such as

“i got two hours sleep last night but that means it was probably the deep restorative sleep as my brain knows best. i will enjoy my day and this will allow me to build up my sleep drive for an awesome night of sleep tonight”

something along that i would say and the u can always go back and read your journal which will be a reminder in writing !!

hope that helps

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

scott,

also just wanted to note i have not heard back from the medical student as both of us shared some insight into his situation.

oh well, it appeared to me that he is aware of the encouragement feedback but just wont implement it

daniel

[spunkyspangler]

hi scott,

yep that is what i am doing, i dont “try” to fall back to sleep, i simply lay in bed and relax. i know that insomnia is all about people trying to force sleep and it just can not respond to that.

i now dont sweat the ” i am going to have a bad day today” like i used to. i just look at the positive saying that i am going to have a great day inspite of this situation, i take the position that my sleep drive will build even better that day which will help when i hit the sack in the evening. i do believe that the sleep window will eventually override this early morning wake up and i will be able to go right to the alarm clock at 5 am !!

i know that it will take time for the pattern change, as i ban all access to the clock when i hit the hay i have no idea what time it is when i become awake. seems to help

thanks for your encouraging words scott

much appreciated

spunky (daniel)

[spunkyspangler]

when i wake up in the middle of the night i seem to be wide awake, not stressed out no anxiety etc so i just lie there to see if sleep will visit me but it doesnt

so what i do is then just simply get up and start my day with the positive outlook that now i will be getting more awake time to build a better sleep drive for the next evening etc

not sure why it is difficult to go back to sleep as i am not trying to sleep that will only ensure i will stay awake !!

any thoughts on that scott ?

[spunkyspangler]

thanks scott,

i shall keep on keeping on cus really whats the alternative LOL !!!

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

new to this sleep window therapy, if u are no longer fearful as u say, but then u say u get hyperarousal isnt that the same thing ???? fear and arousal ???

so are u doing a sleep window and if yes how is that working for u. is your hyperarousal keeping u awake at night etc ??

from what i am learning from martin’s material

sleep drive plus a calm mind equals SLEEP !

[spunkyspangler]

i am new to this since having sleep problems, i know what they say about not letting insomnia dictate your life and i am not sure if it is a mindset switch when one first starts out doing there things. i think it starts out with just being a conscious decision just to do it and i think that the mindset will follow etc

you have to be kind to yourself as well as u stated. i think martin explained from what vids i have seen is that even if one takes baby steps toward your goal of living the life u want it is in fact a step in the right direction.

this morning i had about 2 hours sleep, it was overcast a raining out and i wanted to take my dogs on a trail for exercise early in the morning. i have to say it was very difficult for me to do that as every part of my body was saying stay home and relax conserve energy yada yada

so i just did it, it was painful, and after i got them home was i over the moon with excitement about not letting insomnia dictate to me …………. NO !! but what i did find was that i knew that i did something that in the past i just would not even have attempted so a little part of me said well done at least u are going in the right direction.

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

thanks for your reply. my sleep window is 6 hours from 11pm to 5 am. i have only been at it for a couple of weeks, sometimes i get good sleep in that window, sometimes i wake up at around 3 am or so, dont really know as i dont have any clocks to look at (martins advise).

sometimes i can fall back to sleep most times i can not. i am not stressed out by it but feel awake to the point that i know i am not going to fall back to sleep, so i just get up and start my day really early. days are a tough go for sure !

when u had your sleep window the same as mine 6 hours how long did u stay on that window and can u tell me what your experience was like on it ie trouble falling asleep or wake ups etc et

thanks

[spunkyspangler]

congratulations !! well done !! glad to see successes like this on the forum
i am just starting with the sleep windows and stimulus control etc

it is hard going to work on little to no sleep, as i know u know that only too well

thanks for sharing

[spunkyspangler]

i hear what u are saying, with my insomnia, i was like u i could get sleep for 8 hours no problem at all. then the trigger happened a few months back and at first i could not sleep at all for the entire night.

got so bad that i researched and found CBTI. i think u should look at it from the other side of the coin in that with sleep windows u are not restricting sleep what we are doing is restricting the time of wakefulness

this shortened window at first is more to alien the body with what u are currently getting for sleep. they say never have it under 5 – 5 1/2 hours, so when i did my sleep window i went with 6 hours 11 pm to 5 am. i think u should remember that this is NOT a permanent thing it is just to get your body in a pattern of sleep. once set in then u can expand that window etc etc

i see that u are really hung up on this i must get 7 hours, then perhaps set a sleep window for say 7 hrs and 15 minutes, that may calm your mind around the obsession

i myself am going through my sleep window and it is not easy as u know. this morning i had
sleep interupted by waking during the middle of the night but found since i dont have any clocks that i can check i have no idea what time it was. so i just layed there and relaxed and sleep visited me again until my alarm went off. when it went off did i want to get up, hell no !! but this in my opinion is a short term pain thing to establish a long term gain. already i see improvements in my situation.

hope this helps u

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

hi sleepy med student,

read your post. here is my take on what u have said and just my observations.

1. u stated that “normal” people need at least 7 hours of sleep, so where did u get that “fact” from ????
2. on days that u dont have to go to school or work u are fine so that tells me that your sleep drive is absolutely working just fine, everything as it should be nothing wrong with u
3. days that u have to work the next morning is when u start to go into hyper arousal, worry, clock watch. the mind interprets as a threat cus of all the adrenaline and cortosol in your body and wants to keep u awake to keep u safe, that’s it JOB !!!
4. i am betting that u have not done a sleep window routine and also betting that u have not done stimulus control.
5. clock watching only makes u do sleepeee poooo math, look at the clock 7 hours left, toss and turn, look at the clock 6 hours left yada yada. that stress of looking at the clock only makes the brain work overtime to keep u safe from this threat ( wakefullness). and thus there is no way u are going to sleep.
6. u stated that 5 – 6 way below the 7, so i ask u this, would u rather have 0 hours or 5 times that or 6 times that, i know which one i would take LOL

here is what i would do if i were in this situation.

1. i would set a sleep window for 6 to 6 1/2 hours,
2. i would set an earliest possible bed time
3. i would set the alarm clock and no matter what i would get up at that exact same time every day including the weekends and days that u dont have to go to school etc
4. i would ban all clocks in the bedroom except to turn them around for your alarm.
5. if i could not sleep due to the anxiety then i would leave the bed and go do something that is just a better alternative that tossing and turning, that serves up insomnia even more due to the brain kicking in extra hard to help keep u safe !!

right now from what i read some days u sleep 9 hours some days not so much or get it where u can. your body has not adjusted cus it has no idea of what it is in rythim with.

also, i never ever look at my clock when i shut it down for my sleep window. i dont care what the time is as looking at a clock only increases the sleep math causing more stress.

anyway hope that helps and remember in the beginning there will be short term pain, but the end result will be long term gain !!

spunky

[spunkyspangler]

i have a question for u and it is simply this prior to 2023 did u have problems with your sleep being shallow??

how would u describe your sleep regiment prior to 2023 ??

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