[Chee2308]

Hi @MPerea

That is so absolutely common and normal. It happened to every recovering and even recovered “insomniacs”. But ultimately, because sleep is uncontrollable, there is really nothing anyone can do except getting on with their day. Sleep is governed by circadian rhythm and biological need. As long as you get out of bed at the same time, have light exposure and eat at regular times, these keep your circadian rhythm anchored and your body becomes much more likely to fall asleep when you go to bed.

Ultimately, don’t blame yourself if you can’t sleep, because it really isn’t your fault and is beyond your control. Your body will not punish you for what isn’t your fault. Letting go of control becomes easier when you can heave a sigh of relief and say, I trust my body can handle this better than my worried mind can.

[Chee2308]

Hello everyone here,

Festik has some very good points there and thank you for sharing them. But ultimately, do what feels comfortable and relaxed to you.

Many people feel just staying in bed is super relaxing and that’s what they probably should do. If you never got out of bed when you were sleepless before your insomnia, then doing this now is probably counter-productive and reinforces the idea to your brain that something is very wrong and that night time wakefulness is completely wrong and should be avoided. Could you slowly move away from that and try planting the idea that nighttime wakefulness is just as harmless as daytime wakefulness? Your brain might not make the switch immediately but try to do it slowly.
Your brain will slowly respond over time, try to be patient.

Could I make a suggestion? Go to utube and find this channel calmsparrowchannel, there are lots of videos there that slowly coaxes you to let go of control and let things happen on their own naturally. Trust the process, it will work itself out. There is no need to micromanage everything, your body and the universe has everything worked out and you can just sit back, relax and try to accept things as they unfold. If you find you can’t sleep, perhaps consider laying in bed, listen to the videos on headphones on low volume, relax and absorb what the narrator is saying.

Some helpful mantra to consider repeating to yourself,
Take a deep breath and as you exhale, you are mentally saying to life, “I trust you to handle this better than my worried mind can.”

Best wishes to you all.

[Chee2308]

Colibri

Very sorry to hear your about present condition. So you said it has been like this for 4 months? Did you have an accident or something?

But anyways, it’s probably and hopefully only temporary. Every situation, no matter how dire, can always get better. Don’t lose hope.

I don’t think you are having the fear of not sleeping since you admitted you are doing 6-8. That’s different from folks who go about their every day lives, being scared the heck out of not sleeping well, constantly being in this state of fear all the time and having panic attacks everywhere, wondering if they’ll ever recover. It’s an extremely debilitating situation and can rob anyone of any and every freedom they ever have. In this sense, these people are not doing much better than you so perhaps you can try to see your situation in a different light. But like I said, things can always improve so you may have to exercise a bit more patience and compassion toward yourself.

Best wishes to you and I hope you recover soon.

[Chee2308]

Hi Colibri

Hope you are doing well.
May I enquire further what you meant by sleeping in the morning?
Does that mean you are getting out of bed at noon?

Chee

[Chee2308]

Hello guys!

Glad to say I’ve been doing 6-7 hours now. Having experienced insomnia a second time, here are my key insights and thoughts:

1. Has anyone heard about the DARE challenge? Basically, don’t try to calm or talk yourself out of your difficult situation. Actively challenge it. For example, if you have insomnia related anxiety, and you are having an unpleasant feeling right now, instead of taking deep breaths or trying to calm yourself, say something like, “Make me 10x worse. Right now. Do your worse and let’s see what you’ve got.” Or if you are already feeling okay, you could challenge it by saying, “Insomnia, make me have a panic attack right now.” Keep finding ways to erode the grip that insomnia has over you. Be creative.

2. The concept of befriending wakefulness. Find ways to make wakefulness during bed time fun and exciting. If you find you can’t sleep, do something with that wakefulness so that it’s not scary but fun. Watch an online youtube video, play a puzzle, write a journal, or even go online shopping. Browse and buy yourself that nice watch, wallet, necklace, earrings or whatever you fancy. Call it “Revenge against my insomnia”. Remember that sleep and wakefulness are really two sides of the same coin. You only get one through the other.

3. Is anyone into supplements? Magnesium glycinate and Vitamin D might be helpful.

I hope everyone finds this useful and best wishes to all.

[Chee2308]

Hang in there guys.
Ironically, I also have my own share of sleeping problems lately. I went from doing 8/9 hours during my best to now only 4/5. So yeah, I admit I am struggling again, and it would be nice to be back to sleeping peacefully like before. Because after I recovered years ago, my sleep schedule became super relaxed and I didn’t strictly keep to a sleep window and I just went to and out of bed at any time I wanted. So quite possibly, my circadian rhythm went out of whacks, and I was finding myself falling asleep and waking up progressively later, which isn’t necessarily a problem because I was sleeping, or so I thought.

So when I began going to bed earlier, I developed sleep onset insomnia which progressed to a sleep maintenance one over couple of weeks. I would now be able to fall asleep early in the night but I could only do 4-5 hours straight, the later 2-3 hours (always the more difficult ones to access), which I deem as bonus sleep and which I would usually get until lately, became increasingly inaccessible. That is a source of frustration but behind it all, I was also having health anxiety as well and unsurprisingly, my sleep became disturbed because of it. It would be really nice to sleep that extra 1-3 hours again.

But anyways, sorry for my ranting. Let’s admit it, we’re all only humans and that it’s okay to be struggling again sometimes. We all face issues in our lives that may make peaceful sleep temporarily elusive but let’s keep our spirits up and believe that change is always possible so that we may again find peace in our lives and sleep. Best wishes to everyone.

[Chee2308]

Hi Colibri

I feel quite sorry you are experiencing this very rough patch. I know how horrible it feels being so wired yet frightened all the time.

Let me make an analogy. How does hunger work? Well you go on long enough without food, you automatically will get hungry at some point. It is only a question of when not if.

Sleep works exactly like that. You can’t control when you get hungry, of course. In the same way, you can’t control when your body feel sleepy or when your body decides to wake up either. Of course, you can guesstimate over time but generally, the body does all the work for you. Your body will never reject a comfortable bed if it is really sleepy in the same way your body will never reject eating when it’s starving. Going to bed is analogous to putting food inside your mouth when you’re really hungry. Your body automatically knows what to do next.

You most likely didn’t get insomnia over night. It happened over time. Your thoughts about sleep simply evolved over time. What originally wasn’t a problem became one over repeated conditioning that poor sleep is bad, your body has totally lost its sleep ability, etc. But if that ability was lost, you would get zero sleep all the time, not an hour or two here and there or micro sleeps in between.

Because this is a mental conditioning issue, don’t expect to cure it overnight either. Nobody with insomnia “cured” themselves overnight or popped a magic pill and their sleep problems simply disappeared. But you can evolve to get better. And that’s how everyone here got better. Be patient. The key is desensitization. Slowly get desensitized to how sleep or your perceptions of it affect you.

Education is key. It makes all the difference on what path you should take to get better. But this can also be a lonely journey sometimes. Other people can’t do your journey for you. Ultimately, you need to do much of the heavy lifting yourself. Do it slowly over time and reduce your fears bit by bit. Try not to chase sleep or make it into some sort competition that you must win every time. There is no prize in being the best sleeper or punishment for the worst either.

Allow sleep to happen naturally. Go to bed and tell yourself that the main goal is to relax first. If you are not sleeping, then at least you are resting. Sleep then becomes a byproduct of that relaxation. Good luck and best wishes to you.

[Chee2308]

You haven’t known until you tried. So why not just take it and see what happens? You could always make changes if they don’t turn out well. Sleep should be relaxing and fun.

Also, your past history is a very good guide. There is no reason to think anything has changed. Only your thoughts about sleep might change but the ability to sleep never changes. Good luck and best wishes.

[Chee2308]

How nice it would be if we could control every aspect of our life, isn’t it?

Unfortunately, that’s not how it works. You cannot control when your body decides to wake up in the same way you can’t control how your stomach digests the food you’ve eaten!

Perception is key to everything. Anyone can stay miserable all day simply because they can’t control everything to perfection. Or you can adapt to an everchanging world, taking refuge that there’s actually perfection in an imperfect world because the constant changes make learning and striving for betterment possible. Variety is indeed the spice of what would otherwise be a monotonous, and boring life.

Keep on striving until the end.

[Chee2308]

Hey Robb

Stop obsessing over sleep.
Stop protecting it.

Try not to talk about sleep all the time. Try to live mindfully. Most of the fears about lack of sleep haven’t really happened. Take for example, this chap talked about forgetting his kids’ names. So has he really forgotten them?? I have yet to meet anyone thinking xyz are going to happen if they don’t get a set amount of sleep and xyz happened. Crashing a car, dropping dead, or whatever. Those “what ifs” almost never happen. They invariably are always about the future. Well, you don’t live in the future yet. There’s only the now and you can’t change the past either. So try not to dwell on the past, focus on the present, acknowledge the future but keep bearing in mind, you can’t always control future outcomes either. You can’t really control anything, really, to be honest. Take it one step at a time. You are only human, so you cannot control each and everything.

Did you take benzos as a kid? What about sleeping pills? In fact did you worry about sleep as a baby, at all?? How come all of a sudden, they’re all needed now either? Has your body “forgotten” how to sleep? Challenge that notion. Because in a similar sense, can you really forget how to breathe? Or eat? Walk? Run? Pee? Why do your body or its organs need all this “reminding” now about how to sleep? And it needs pills to “jolt” its memory every single night? How absurd is that.

If I was back to the worst days of my insomnia here’s what I would do:

1. Set regular times for bed. Spend at least 6 hours in bed but not more than 8.
2. Then spend an hour or two after waking up to feel whatever. Fear, joy, anxiety, dread, guilt, regret or whatever. Acknowledge anything, nothing’s off limits. You can write them down if you want. When the time’s up, get on with your day. No more obsessing or talking about sleep. Focus on your chores or errands. Whenever you feel fear or dread, remind yourself that the time for sleep related thoughts has passed, so you need to wait until the next morning. Then refocus back on your tasks.

Rinse and repeat every single day, aka mindful living. Because there is a time for everything and everything is given a chance to express itself. Don’t push your negative notions about insomnia away either. Give them some space to express themselves until such time you are convinced that they’re no longer important or relevant in your life.

If you find yourself unable to doze off during your bedtime, just do what you did before your insomnia. Did you get up or just lay in bed? Then do exactly that. Always try to revert to your old self as much as possible as this is a good baseline to work on. You always want to get back to that state where the occasional insomnia isn’t given much thought or attention. Good luck.

[Chee2308]

Hi Colibri,

I was a graduate of Martin. Check under my handle, chee2308, because it says client.

I know exactly what I went through to know what exactly you are going through now. So I know what you are talking about in your long posts.

But anyways, my sleep problems have long gone and honestly, these problems aren’t mine anymore, so to speak, therefore I don’t really to need to respond at all and I have resisted doing this because I was waiting to see what others would say and also, to see what Martin’s reply is but I am not seeing anyone saying anything that’s truly helpful at all and I felt like I had to step in and tell you what you are doing incorrectly because I am trying to tell you what you need to do to get out of it.

Unfortunately, I can’t help anyone who refuse to accept honest advice. So I will stop responding if you can’t find my advice helpful. Good luck to you and I wish you well.

[Chee2308]

Hi guys,

May I quip in for a bit? I am a recovered insomniac since 2020 and I sleep absolutely wonderfully and peacefully now.

Have you tried doing nothing for a change? Except getting into and out of bed at regular times. That’s it. The absolute bare minimum. Everything else is just noise. What you are really dealing with is just noise inside your head and it keeps prompting you to do this and that, take benzos, take pills, do relaxation exercises, drink “sleepy” teas and the list goes on and on and on. All that will not help if you don’t address the big elephant in the room: the fear of poor sleep. Living in fear all the time simply because you think you can’t sleep well. It is essentially losing sleep over sleep itself. To get out of this mess, you will need to stop fearing it. Yes, you will sleep bad on some nights but so what’s the big deal?? Make yourself confront the scenario.

You will need to start making light of your insomnia. Be creative. Doing this will decrease the impact your own thoughts have on you. Because all this is essentially self fear-mongering. You are literally frightening yourself awake. If you choose to keep engaging in endless mind battles, you will always get stuck in it. Go the other way. Stop engaging and stop bothering about it. Do it slowly and everything will settle down.

Make fun of insomnia. Be satirical about it. That will lessen the grip it has over you. When I can’t sleep, I make poems about it too:

Night’s dark canvas, stars up high
My mind’s a mess, can’t deny
The thoughts they swirl, like a restless sea
As I lie here, wide-eyed and free

[Chee2308]

Hello and welcome to the forum!

Unfortunately, there is no right or wrong answer to your query. It all depends on you.

With that said, insomnia is strictly not a medical problem, it is more of a perception issue and more closely mimics a phobia problem. You simply just have an aversion of poor sleep. Phobias are not cured by taking anything external, it is an internal issue, because it’s all mental. Whatever you need to treat yourself, you already have it all inside you.

You also said it yourself, you want to sleep naturally, so you already believe the issue is internal not external. Would you continue to take medicine for a condition you never believed you have? If you don’t have flu, would you take anti-flu medication? Or if you don’t believe you have cancer, why would you start doing chemo and take all kinds of anti-cancer drugs, believing they all “work” in keeping cancer away?? The scenario doesn’t make any sense. If you never needed any medicine to sleep when you were born, why would you suddenly need them all now either? What actually made you sleep all these years including when you were a baby? All those drugs or your body itself?

Whatever you do to try to sleep automatically reinforces your insomnia. Because they keep you living in fear of poor sleep. That kind of stress is mentally stimulating enough to keep you awake. You must overcome these fears if you want to beat insomnia. Good luck and best wishes.

[Chee2308]

In my experience, the trick is tricking the brain into thinking insomnia is not a problem. Not sleeping well temporarily isn’t a problem. Everyone has insomnia. You too must have had insomnia countless times when you were young as a child. But you never thought there was a problem then. So how come has your mind suddenly thought there’s a problem now? So what changed? And what didn’t change? You have to find out the answers yourself. This is battle often fought alone. We can only provide some advice and guidance here but ultimately, it will be up to you how you approach the issue.

Trying to fix insomnia will never fix it, you only get stuck in a endless battle ending with perpetual dissatisfaction over it. You have to not fix it because trying to fix the problem actually becomes the problem itself. Leave insomnia alone until it leaves you alone. Essentially, what insomnia actually is losing some sleep over sleep. So how to stop this? Well, don’t worry about sleep. That’s when everything starts calming down and things start getting better.

Good luck.

[Chee2308]

Hello and welcome.

So what are you worried about? Isn’t falling asleep what you want?So why does an adrenaline rush happen when you’re trying to make that happen anyways? Does that make any sense?

I think you really need to engage more deeply with yourself on the matter. Find out what you are truly afraid of. What’s the worst that can happen if you can’t fall asleep anyways? Entertain that outcome. Don’t push it away or try to avoid it. Avoiding doesn’t help you overcome your fears. It just makes them worse.

Once the fear of not sleeping well and/or its consequences are taken care of, then perhaps sleep will happen more easily. Sleep is only more likely to happen in a calm and relaxed state of mind and body. Worry and fear won’t help in any way, but they only make it worse so it’s neither productive nor reasonable to live in a constant state of panic and fear all the time without addressing them proactively and adequately.

Best wishes to you and I hope you find your calm and peace soon.

[Author]

Posts