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Sleep can happen regardless of the amount of light in our environment.
It sounds like your experience is telling you that the more you try to control sleep, the more of a struggle it becomes.
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Your experience is not unusual!
It makes complete sense that you are measuring progress based on how you sleep each night — and, at the same time, perhaps that might be setting you up for some struggle if your experience tells you that sleep isn’t within your direct control.
Ups and downs and difficult nights and better nights are all part of the journey. What matters is what you are learning and how you respond when you hit these bumps in the road.
Have you talked about your experience and your concerns with your CBT-I therapist?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Hello Edgar!
To answer your question, I guess it’s possible for some people to sleep less than four or five hours because sleep needs vary from person to person (and even from person to person sleep needs can change on a daily basis).
With that being said, I’ve not heard of anyone who *always* sleeps for less than two hours each night indefinitely. A string of nights of that kind of sleep are possible, but on a permanent basis I’ve not heard of any examples.
As you suggested, sleep misperception might play a role here — studies have found that people with insomnia typically under-report the amount of sleep they get at night (and people without insomnia typically over-report the amount of sleep they get at night).
I’d say that, ultimately, it’s hard to know how much sleep we are actually getting for sure (without overnight polysomnography) because we are asleep when it happens and sleep tracking devices aren’t necessarily accurate.
Nothing you’ve shared in your post strikes me as unique or unusual. You are dealing with all the difficulties associated with the insomnia struggle. I can’t say if or when you might get less sleep or more sleep in the future. And, I am going to guess that your experience tells you that sleep is out of your direct control anyway.
You can, on the other hand, always control your actions — and it’s your actions that might have the biggest influence on whether or not conditions are good for sleep to happen and whether or not sleep becomes an exhausting effort and struggle or is given permission to take care of itself and become effortless.
Moving away from the effort, the trying, and the resistance is usually very difficult and it can also be very scary. There will be ups and downs. It takes ongoing practice and the development of new skills. Not new skills to make sleep happen or control your mind, but new skills to give sleep the opportunity to take care of itself by removing yourself from the process.
I hope there’s something useful here.
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Hello @Insomniaguy and welcome to the forum. You are understandably concerned by the fact it is taking more and more time for you to fall asleep. As a result, you are getting less and less sleep.
There is no evidence that insomnia causes any health problem whatsoever — and that includes mortality. This might explain why we see some people who aren’t on an actionable path away from the insomnia struggle able to live with it for decades.
I hope this provides some reassurance and if there’s anything else, please share!
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Hello Emmy and welcome to the forum. You’ve got a lot going on and that makes dealing with sleep disruption even more difficult.
Many people in a situation similar to yours have found the more they try to calm their nervous system, the more it seems to fight back. What has your experience been?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Welcome to the forum — you are not alone!
It sounds like your experience suggests that, even when worry disappears, at some point it’s going to come back again. That perhaps makes sense when we consider that worry is a natural and normal human feeling.
It also sounds like worry is evidence of your brain doing its job of looking out for you and reminding you of what matters. You want to do well at your new job. That’s important to you.
In conclusion, perhaps worry comes from a good place and perhaps worry is out of your direct control.
Actions, on the other hand, are always within your control — and that might be empowering since it means you get to decide how you respond to worry.
You can try to fight or avoid it, battle, and struggle with it (and where does that get you) — or you can acknowledge and make space for it to exist (and perhaps even thank your brain for looking out for you!).
You also get to choose how you respond to nights when sleep doesn’t happen as you want it to, and whether you spend time reading fear-mongering articles or use that time to engage in actions that reflect who you are, who you want to be, and the life you want to live.
Since you are the expert on you, what feels like the most workable way of dealing with all this?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
This is a good question! What guidance does your own experience have to offer you?
According to your own experience, how effective is a strategy of trying to fall asleep, trying to fall back to sleep, or trying to make a certain amount or type of sleep happen through effort?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Thanks for the update. What kind of medical advice (or treatment) have you been offered for the alpha-delta intrusion sleep? What connection, if any, is there between your current relationship with sleep and your experience with anxiety and depression?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
After giving yourself permission to stop struggling with sleep, a weight has been lifted off your shoulders. That extra time you now have for yourself in the mornings sounds blissful, TOHO!
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
It makes complete sense that you feel afraid of what might happen to your mental state if you happen to be awake for days — especially as a mother with two small kids.
I can’t speak for others but I suspect you aren’t alone in experiencing that kind of fear — it comes from your brain doing its job and looking out for you.
How do you usually respond to that fear, and what are you learning from that response?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
You are taking action, learning from your actions, and experiencing change thanks to your actions, TOHO.
Your bed has become less of a battleground. You are getting more comfortable with wakefulness (which, in turn, makes it less difficult to experience). You know you can get through the next day and do what matters, independently of sleep.
You are getting your mornings back. You are enjoying screens at night. You are breaking down sleep-related rules and rituals.
You are getting your life back from insomnia and moving away from the insomnia struggle.
I wish you all the best as you continue on your journey!
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Your problem-solving brain is generating thoughts and feelings as it does its job of looking out for you and reminding you of what’s important.
What makes worry a problem for you, @Anna1?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
It’s definitely OK to share!
Thanks to your growth mindset, you’ve identified “relapses” or times when you might experience sleep differently to how you want (or notice you might be getting pulled back into the struggle) as reminders and opportunities to practice what you’ve been learning.
You are building evidence of your superpowers. Your grit. Your determination. Your resilience. The fact you have all the power because you always get to choose your actions and your response.
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Thanks for sharing your curiosity and willingness to experiment, @Marjoe!
Drowsiness is going to show up eventually even if you are doing jumping jacks on a trampoline — however, it might take a bit longer if you choose to do that 😜
If your goal isn’t to make sleep happen (it’s just to experience wakefulness with less struggle and less resistance) then it doesn’t matter what you do.
What kind of ideas have you come up with so far?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
Hello Thérèse and thanks for sharing that getting out of bed at 7:00 AM comes with the benefit of giving you your mornings back — what kind of things are you doing with that additional time that’s now available to you?
A sleep window isn’t supposed to make sleep happen or get rid of nighttime wakefulness because those things are out of your control. Sleep cannot be made to happen through effort and nighttime wakefulness cannot be eliminated through effort.
A sleep window is more about moving you away from chasing after sleep by doing things like going to bed earlier in an effort to make sleep happen or staying in bed later in an effort to make sleep happen.
A sleep window comes with some additional bonuses that can help set the stage for sleep, too (but there’s still no guarantees!). A consistent out of bed time helps to strengthen the body clock and ensures enough time for sleep pressure to build during the day.
Less time in bed also means less opportunity to struggle with being awake when you want to be asleep and more opportunity to engage in the world around you and do things that matter.
Does this help?
—If you are ready to stop struggling with insomnia you can enroll in the online insomnia coaching course right now! If you would prefer ongoing phone or video coaching calls as part of a powerful three month program that will help you reclaim your life from insomnia, consider applying for the Insomnia Mastery program.
The content of this post is provided for informational and educational purposes only. It is not medical advice and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, disorder, or medical condition. It should never replace any advice given to you by your physician or any other licensed healthcare provider. Insomnia Coach LLC offers coaching services only and does not provide therapy, counseling, medical advice, or medical treatment. All content is provided “as is” and without warranties, either express or implied.
